You left out the part where the ones on the bikes are going the fraction of the speed
And they left out that emergency vehicles and transit take up more room but really shouldn’t be blocked on speed just on argument of size and space alone. Not even cars would block based on ‘me smaller than them and take up less room’. So it’s a shit attitude and argument here all the way through about size and space as somehow more entitled.
That’s only used in bike races, to act as a booster for extra speed/acceleration, much like a rocket does
As a cyclist, two people cycling side by side while other vehicles are waiting to pass is a bit of a dick move tbh.
Not illegal, and nothing compared to the shit that drivers do to cyclists, but still a bit of a dick move.
Cycling two abreast is better for the driver, since they can overtake much quicker.
That image is quite a niche scenario and doesn’t represent the situation in the original image.
Obviously it’s different with a group of eight compared to just two people…
niche scenario
Never been to a country where road cycling is massive then? Try living in anyplace that has Alps in it lol
How is it different though? In the original picture you can safely overtake the two of them in about half the time and half the available opening in traffic compared to them riding single file.
The image appears to be from the UK. Here in the UK cyclists are supposed to stay at least 0.5m from the kerb, with a recommendation for more distance if possible (rule 72 of the Highway Code). Cars are supposed to keep at least 1.5m away from cyclists when overtaking (rule 163). Taking an average cyclist width of 60cm (some handlebars go much wider than that, as might pannier bags, but let’s use that as an average), that means a single cyclist should have control of ~2.6m of the lane at least.
Let’s say that the average lane on urban roads in the UK are around 3m wide (an estimate based on a quick google, not a rule), this means a legal overtake of a cyclist should have the car leaving no more than 40cm of the car in the lane. It’s not a big jump from that to moving entirely into the other lane.
Admittedly almost no one in the UK actually follows these rules, but this is how it’s supposed to be. Given that, adding another cyclist riding abreast shouldn’t affect overtaking time significantly, whereas the two cyclists riding in line will double the amount of time in the oncoming lane.
it doesn’t actually ever say why they should. It completely ignores that it obviously takes longer to drive across into the other lane and then back than to pass the cyclists
Because it’s SAFER. Oh my god, have we really got so selfish that a human life is worth like a second.
As I’ve mentioned elsewhere, in the UK (which is where this image seems to be from), the “safe” passing distance for a car overtaking a bike is supposed to be 1.5m. Add that to the 0.5m minimum distance the cyclist is supposed to be from the kerb and the width of the cyclist themselves, and overtaking even a single cyclist should have the car almost entirely in the other lane anyway (UK lanes are typically narrower than their US counterparts).
Whether anyone actually follows those rules is another question, but that is how motorists are supposed to behave.
It is also written into our Highway Code that motorists should “give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders and horse drawn vehicles at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car”
Great image, but you see people really don’t want to use their steering wheels. And if possible they’d like pedestrian crossings removed as well. In ideal world there would be a race track from their home to exactly where they need to go and everyone else in traffic is a dick. Including other car drivers. Learning traffic laws and rules is too much of an effort anyway.
If cyclists can use the whole lane (common situation in the United States for example), it is (almost always) illegal for a driver to leave their drivable portion of the road to pass someone, bicyclist or otherwise. That includes crossing any lines, going to the opposite side of the road, being on the shoulder or sidewalk, etc.
Without a separate bicycle lane, it is not permitted to pass a bicyclist.
Which is why everyone hates cyclists. Y’all are the left lane campers of the freeway.
If a sign is posted saying ‘Bicyclists may use full lane’ then that lane is now a bicycle lane with cars being allowed on it for some reason. Check your car brain.
Don’t hate the cyclists, hate the government. We all want separate cycle lanes.
I’m not sure I’m understanding… as a driver you can legally pass by going into the opposing lane momentarily, as long as the line in the center is dashed (not solid) on your side and there is no oncoming traffic. That’s kind of the whole reason the center line is painted like that, combined with those signs that say “do not pass” and “pass with caution” when the line goes solid and back to dashed.
In that scenario, that would be part of the drivable area yes. However, that is exceedingly rare in the United States at least from my experience in smaller cities/suburbia (east coast). I regularly see people breaking the law by driving on the shoulder to go around someone turning left, and illegally crossing a solid double yellow line to pass a bicyclist.
And just so we’re clear, the reason it’s a dick move is the car can move faster than the bike so blocking the car robs the people in the car if its full utility. They’re now forced to go your speed, which is probably less than the speed limit.
Where do you see another vehicle “waiting to pass”? There’s absolutely nothing in this picture telling you how much traffic there is, how wide the road is, etc. Nothing.
What can be seen in the picture, however, is a car that, no matter the speed, is tailgating way too close. Which is a misdemeanor in some countries.
So it’s a bit of a conundrum. Because there are pros and cons in riding abreast.
On one hand, cyclists are more compact and more visible. On the other filling whole lane would mean drivers behind them would have to time their overtaking. However, car drivers almost never leave enough space when overtaking cyclists and 100% never think about wind that might push them or that cyclist might need more space to avoid potholes and stuff. So being a dick driver is not exclusive to cyclists.
Traffic law, at least where I live, states when overtaking cyclists driver must leave enough space between him and the cyclist so as to not inconvenience cyclist. Which is vague and not helping one bit. However I think it’s far better to be forced to slow down and time overtaking than not slowing down and flying next to a single lane of cyclists. Because if and when there’s a car coming from opposite direction, car driver won’t care or look twice to move closer to the edge of the road and push others out.
This sub is pointless until it can provide a solution to having to get somewhere 30 miles from here when it’s 10 below outside for most of the winter.
Dont give me that it’s not always 10 below excuse. It is often 10 below or lower for long stretches in the north. Biking is simply not viable or practical.
Look at this example. Looks like it’s 80 and sunny with the top down on a convertible and everyone in summer clothes.
Everyone doesn’t live in Arizona, kar Karen.
This sub is pointless until it can provide a solution to having to get somewhere 30 miles from here when it’s 10 below outside for most of the winter.
-10F or -10C?
-10C really isn’t very cold. The average low in Oulu, Finland in February is -12C, and ~10% of all trips there in the winter are via bike because they have an extensive network of well-plowed bike paths.
Biking in -10C is really just a matter of having appropriate gear to block the wind - similar to what you’d wear skiing like a jacket, mittens and a neck gator/ski mask. -10C isn’t warm, but people do outdoor winter sports literally all the time in -10C. It’s fine.
-10F needs better cold gear, and is probably going to be pretty uncomfortable for most people. You definitely have to worry about preventing frostbite, and I definitely know skiers who would stay inside.
But most places don’t really stay -10F. That’s like Fargo or Fairbanks cold, not Buffalo or Boston cold. Chicago has only gotten down to -10F in three years in the past decade. Relatively few people live in places that regularly stay -10F.
Although there’s a standard solution for 30 mile trips that works in basically all temperatures: a bus or train. Which isn’t really practical in American style suburban sprawl, but is very practical in denser walkable European towns and cities.
-10 degrees Celsius is about 14 degrees fahrenheit, which by all measures is still fucking cold to human beings.
Edit: missed the -
Dont give me that it’s not always 10 below excuse. It is often 10 below or lower for long stretches in the north. Biking is simply not viable or practical.
“It’s sometimes cold, therefore you can never bike”
Solid take there.
10 below it not biking 30.miles to work either there, hero .
What a clown u are.
The only clown here is you, and the ratio confirms it. Take the L and leave
Public transport? Or cars. Some people on here may be militant about getting rid of all cars, but most of us aren’t that extreme. We simply want to have the option to not use cars, which is currently not the case in many regions of the world.
There is no public transport that is even remotely able to serve the rural population.
You always have the option to not use a car if weather permits no one is stopping you. Your last statement is simply not true.
Only 20% of the US is rural.
80% of the US lives in metropolitan and micropolitan areas. In small towns, suburbs and cities.
People on this sub aren’t saying that we should force Old Macdonald to take the bus from the farm to the feed store. You’re never going to get rid of all cars. They have an important niche.
You always have the option to not use a car if weather permits no one is stopping you.
I mean, in a technical sense that’s true. Practically, though, people respond to their built environment. There’s a reason way more people drive to work in Rome than Barcelona, and it ain’t the weather. And there’s a reason way more people bike in the winter in Oulu, Finland than Syracuse, NY despite having similar populations and climate.
Most people aren’t ideological “drivers” or “pedestrians”, they’re just people who want to get somewhere and will follow the path of least resistance. Put them in Amsterdam and they’ll happily bike to their destination, put them in Houston and they wouldn’t.
If we assume there isn’t another solution to that, why does it matter? Why does your need for a car for your specific use negate any use of alternatives anywhere? We can still advocate for better transportation and land use in cities, even if the proposed solution doesn’t work for your journey between Plunkett and Blucher.
Where have you ever heard car drivers say something like this? Do you guys just make up fake arguments to have with yourselves?
I’ve seen people say this here and on Reddit. I guarantee you the dickheads doing close passes and yelling at me to get off the road would say this.
EDIT: There’s literally people in this thread saying this…
The issue isn’t with cyclists being on the road, it’s with them blocking the road while going significantly slower than traffic. Motorbikes aren’t a similar problem because they’re quick enough not to disrupt everyone else on the road.
Edit: For the benefit of the downvoters - I’m a cyclist, you dopey fucks - I’m just honest about the issue drivers have with us. Making up this bullshit just makes us look like liars that don’t understand the people we’re sharing the road with, and our reality-based arguments work perfectly well. Be better.
What are we supposed to do? We can’t cycle on the sidewalk, and if we get closer to the curb, it gives many drivers the false impression that they can overtake without crossing into the other lane, not to mention all the potholes, drains, and trash that we then have to cycle over.
It seems like a dick move, but I promise you that most cyclists are purposefully being in your way to make sure you notice, slow down, and give us space. We’re just as unhappy about being around your car as you are to see us. We’d happily fuck the fuck off to our own little lane if someone gave us one.
Agreed, which is why we need bike lanes so that traffic isn’t slowed down.
Fuck both groups
exactly.
both groups abuse their power to deny pedestrians their domain over the roads.
