Comment by qyron@sopuli.xyz on S'koden.

So… a room full of fascists against two individuals.

To me, this implies they will either be drugged, to be impaired, or chained. Otherwise, the numbers win.

I’m not a butcher. Criminals are to be dealt as such. Death is too short of sentence to be a punishment.

Death is too short of sentence

It’s a crowbar, not a flamethrower. Pick your targets, avoid the head and soft tissue/core areas. Have fun.

You missed the sentence where I declare myself as not being a butcher.

Well then you don’t have a strong sense of survival or justice. That’s ok. You can weave baskets while I do it. Everybody has a place.

And now you are missing the part where I state that I will fight, both for me and others. I refuse to butcher others, like the criminals we are denouncing, not to fight them.

How is fighting for survival different than butchering people who would butcher you?

Edit: to begin a better world you have to understand that your hands will have to get dirty not by choice but out of necessity to survive. Do you not have a survival instinct?

Here is the difference, in my view.

I will fight fascist wherever I am met with them. I’ll denounce their ideals, call out their hatred and bigotry towards others, expose their crimes and atrocities. And I will fight them, to the risk of my own life, to defend others from them, if such need arises.

I will not hide behind hollow rethoric to justify killing another human being. I will not persecute a fascist’s family or children, I will not execute fascists summarilly nor cruelly. I will not condone torture.

I want justice. I want fascists arrested, put to trial, sentenced to prison and put to work to rebuild every little thing they destroyed, plowing fields to feed the hungry. I will not become worst than them in the process of getting rid of them.

How does killing a bunch of them with crowbars begin a better world? Did that work the first time? It sounds to me like we’re trapped in a cycle.

Criminal law doesn’t work on Nazis. They control the courts. Very few non violent options left I’m afraid.

Try this: fascists.

The German National Party is no more.

There is a difference between resorting to force to push down and cull the scum trying to topple the world and resorting to violence like they are, to butcher those they see as worthless, unfit, different.

Force, not violence.

If they salute like a nazi then they are a nazi. Modeled after the German variety of fascism venerating Hitler etc. Neo-nazi would work I guess, but everything they’ve been doing is straight out of Hitler’s playbook so I feel comfortable using the term nazi.

As for projection of force, you don’t really have any to project. Any resistance would need to be very asymmetric in nature ie high value targets using guerilla methods. I think the difference between force and violence is semantic and really only serves as a euphemism. Moreover you need to create a spectacle of violence. Luigi mangione didn’t use force.

That’s your prerrogative; I respect that. It won’t be small differences like those putting us on opposite corners.

Will I call the act of Mangione as brutal? Yes. But it ended there. The guy did not went on a rampage, after the man’s family and others. So, it was a resort to force, not to violence.

We’re seeing violence being enacted towards groups and individuals. Mass killings in Gaza, torture, starvation, exposure… that is violence.

Going up against a group, even if well organized, by attacking and eliminating key figures, that’s force.

Allow me a more down to earth example: you see an ICE raid mounting. You organize a group of neighbours, hold the cops at gun point, beat the lights out of them, in extremis, a few die, and warn them they are not to come back there.

That’s force.

You kill everyone, raid and destroy their station, go after their families and friends, and hit on sight every single agent.

That’s violence.

I only wish in them what they wish on me. Anyone who has an issue with that is enabling fascism.

So, given that the average fascist considers anyone who does not subscribe their narrow view of the world as worthless and disposeable and are known to be very expedite on devising cruel and brutal ways to dispose of those they dislike, it would be fair, on your understanding, that the fascists underwent the exact same treatment?

Good for you, I risk?

sure, on Lemmy you’re that guy.

It’s a crowbar, not a boning knife

Fascists double down on their fascism in response to punishment. Dead fascists, preferably by natural causes of course, do not.

Not this new brand, the moment they’re actually forced to face consequences for their actions, they tend to shut up.

You know. You might be right.

However, I think it’s best to test out both possibilities in a years-long experiment. Just to be sure.

Someone has to play that part. Why not me?

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