That is what I wonder. Don’t know about you guys, but I feel like a European patriot, even though this maybe does not make sense to some.

Being a true European patriot means to me: caring about all of the freedoms we have, our social democracies, is to value the open pluralist societies we developed since WW2, wanting to protect what the reactionaries want to take away from us, stop those who want to lock us all up, back in the small closed-minded nation-states we all come from, which will ultimately lick the boots of either US or China/Russia.

They are well organized, but what is the organization, the movement that fights against this ongoing attack on our shared values and mode of existence?

The post-WW2 Europe is an oasis of bliss in a world which is on fire, and we are all under attack. How can we fight against this destruction from the inside as well as from the outside ?

You are viewing a single thread.
View all comments
72 points

Fix wealth inequality. Rich people accumulate so much money that there’s hardly any left for average people. Rich people hoard assets like houses and increase their prices and the cost of living. As long as we don’t fix this, things will get worse. As long as politicians don’t fix this other parties will get more popular no matter what they offer.

Migrants are just scapegoats. They have no lobby, they are easy to blame. They are one piece in a bigger equation. They are used as a ruse to distract from bigger problems. If the housing market was functional it could handle the influx of Ukranian refugees and the way smaller number of refugees from countries like Afghanistan or regions like Africa.

If countries had funds from wealth and inheritance taxes they could fund a working administration, faster justice systems, working infrastructure and so on. It would be absolutely beautiful and I cannot say why there isn’t a bigger movement for that solution.

It’s not about taxing 100.000€ in stock, or you inheriting your mum’s cottage, but about taxing people who have been living off intergenerational wealth for decades without ever working at all.

permalink
report
reply
-6 points

I agree with you a 100% on the wealth issue. Though the number of migrants from the middle east is and will be more problematic for a small country like Austria.

Therefore you need to tackle both problems at once. I’m tired of people ignoring the fact. No country wants to become Libanon 2.0.

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points
*

No country wants to become Libanon 2.0.

What does that mean?

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

Yeah no fuck off

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

That’s quite reformist. But I would agree. It would be an ok step to start constructing a socialist state.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-6 points

And how would you fix wealth inequality, without causing capital flight.

permalink
report
parent
reply
19 points

Capital can’t flee. The money is all bound in assets. How you gonna move the houses out of Europe?

China doesn’t allow me to own 100M USD worth of assets and live abroad without paying any tax. Why do we?

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point
*

You do pay taxes in the EU if you own assets in the EU.

China taxes quite a lot less than the EU I’m sure. Otherwise nobody would have built their factories there.

Edit: China taxes capital more it seems

In the European Union (EU), the share of labour taxes (including social contributions) in total tax revenues expanded in 2023 to 51.2%, while the share of capital tax revenues remained unchanged at 21.9%. This indicates that labour taxes contribute significantly more to the EU’s total tax revenue compared to capital taxes.

In China, the effective tax rate (ETR) on capital rose from 10% to 30% between 1995 and 2018, while labour taxation also saw a slow but steady rise. However, specific figures on the proportion of tax revenue from capital versus labour in China are not provided in the search results.

For more detailed and precise information, it would be beneficial to consult the latest reports from organizations such as the OECD or national tax authorities.

https://www.beursgorilla.nl/Index-Koers/150176326/CHINA-Shanghai-Composite.aspx

But as you can see, the stock market since then has been quite dull

Edit2:

In the United States, corporate income taxes accounted for 6.5% of total U.S. tax revenue in 2022. This figure represents the portion of total tax revenue derived from taxing corporate profits, which is a form of capital income.

For more detailed and precise information, it would be beneficial to consult the latest reports from organizations such as the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) or the U.S. Treasury.

And the SP500 has been the desire of the world. The USA is 60% of a world ETF

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

Facotries, houses and even companies can not be easily moved. Even something like a bank needs employees, with certain skills and those have value. You usually can not just move those to another country, unless something really drastic happens.

The other part is to organize. Something like the minimum company tax is a really good starting point. Most large countries have relativly high taxes anyway. The only reason tax heavens work is, because they have a tiny population and the few hundret jobs created by the paperwork are enough to support them. They could easily be bullied into having normal taxes.

Also keep in mind the EU has 1/5 of the global economy by itself.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-2 points

USA has 6,5% tax on capital EU 20%.

We attract capital because we offer stability.

Taxing the shit out of their made investments does not offer stability. They’d stop putting in new investments.

We’d have decay.

USA is the capital of the world when it comes to capitalism. A world ETF market weighted gives you 60% USA. That’s massive.

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

We pay for using that capital. We pay rent, we pay for groceries, we pay for gas. Everytime we pay something, somebody makes money. Tax them.

permalink
report
parent
reply
-1 points

Why would they invest in your apartment if they have to pay taxes on it? Unless they can charge the tax to you as well.

You’re going to need the public to build your apartment. And sadly, in Singapore where this is the case, rent is ridiculously high.

permalink
report
parent
reply
21 points
*

This is the number one thing. The US collapsed because of inequality. Liberals are out.

And it can be summarised in one word: materialism.

permalink
report
parent
reply
19 points
*

Yes to all but for completeness you probably want to spell out this important effect of wealth inequality. The wealth consolidated at the top buys state power which then helps distribute even more wealth to the top. As long as this feedback loop is allowed to run, none of the other proposed solutions would help. For example, education is amended to teach people to support the feedback loop, not break it.

What could solving this look in practice? Actively participate in your union, unionize, vote for economic left parties that support unionization and breaking the wealth inequality loop.

permalink
report
parent
reply
9 points

That’s the only solution.

permalink
report
parent
reply
8 points

But we could also try fascism again. Maybe it works this time.

/s

permalink
report
parent
reply
12 points

Nobody is really trying to stop the oligarchs and their lobbies, it’s the only real political taboo that remains. People watch the right rising and it’s being shown as if that was coming out of nowhere and too unregulated capitalism wasn’t the main driver of the issue. The occasional article points out that billionaires should not have so much power or even exist, but these are drowned in the noise of the media.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points
*

100%. Only if you solve wealth inequality, the other proposed solutions become effective in keeping inequality and therefore fascism low. If you don’t solve wealth inequality, they’re rendered ineffective by the accumulated wealth.

permalink
report
parent
reply

Europe

!europe@feddit.org

Create post

News and information from Europe 🇪🇺

(Current banner: La Mancha, Spain. Feel free to post submissions for banner images.)

Rules (2024-08-30)

  1. This is an English-language community. Comments should be in English. Posts can link to non-English news sources when providing a full-text translation in the post description. Automated translations are fine, as long as they don’t overly distort the content.
  2. No links to misinformation or commercial advertising. When you post outdated/historic articles, add the year of publication to the post title. Infographics must include a source and a year of creation; if possible, also provide a link to the source.
  3. Be kind to each other, and argue in good faith. Don’t post direct insults nor disrespectful and condescending comments. Don’t troll nor incite hatred. Don’t look for novel argumentation strategies at Wikipedia’s List of fallacies.
  4. No bigotry, sexism, racism, antisemitism, islamophobia, dehumanization of minorities, or glorification of National Socialism. We follow German law; don’t question the statehood of Israel.
  5. Be the signal, not the noise: Strive to post insightful comments. Add “/s” when you’re being sarcastic (and don’t use it to break rule no. 3).
  6. If you link to paywalled information, please provide also a link to a freely available archived version. Alternatively, try to find a different source.
  7. Light-hearted content, memes, and posts about your European everyday belong in !yurop@lemm.ee. (They’re cool, you should subscribe there too!)
  8. Don’t evade bans. If we notice ban evasion, that will result in a permanent ban for all the accounts we can associate with you.
  9. No posts linking to speculative reporting about ongoing events with unclear backgrounds. Please wait at least 12 hours. (E.g., do not post breathless reporting on an ongoing terror attack.)
  10. Always provide context with posts: Don’t post uncontextualized images or videos, and don’t start discussions without giving some context first.

(This list may get expanded as necessary.)

Posts that link to the following sources will be removed

  • on any topic: RT, news-pravda:com, GB News, Fox, Breitbart, Daily Caller, OAN, sociable:co, citjourno:com, brusselssignal:eu, europesays:com, geo-trends:eu, any AI slop sites (when in doubt please look for a credible imprint/about page), change:org (for privacy reasons)
  • on Middle-East topics: Al Jazeera
  • on Hungary: Euronews

Unless they’re the only sources, please also avoid The Sun, Daily Mail, any “thinktank” type organization, and non-Lemmy social media. Don’t link to Twitter directly, instead use xcancel.com. For Reddit, use old:reddit:com

(Lists may get expanded as necessary.)

Ban lengths, etc.

We will use some leeway to decide whether to remove a comment.

If need be, there are also bans: 3 days for lighter offenses, 7 or 14 days for bigger offenses, and permanent bans for people who don’t show any willingness to participate productively. If we think the ban reason is obvious, we may not specifically write to you.

If you want to protest a removal or ban, feel free to write privately to the primary mod account @EuroMod@feddit.org

Community stats

  • 7K

    Monthly active users

  • 3.7K

    Posts

  • 31K

    Comments