That might be the stated intent, but it seems plain that once the leaders are in positions of power and authority, they abuse their power. This is why, as fallible as is democracy, it is superior.
I would also contend that the outcomes for those living under communism are vastly inferior to those living under capitalism. I’ve always been bemused by arguments that all the repeated attempts “don’t count,” as though seventh time is the charm and suddenly the major issues will be worked out.
That might be the stated intent, but it seems plain that once the leaders are in positions of power and authority, they abuse their power. This is why, as fallible as is democracy, it is superior.
Do you think that socialism/communism is not a democratic system?
Under communism, no. Marx explicitly prescribed violent revolution to overthrow democracy. He prescribes implementing democracy after the glorious revolution, but previous attempts never progressed to that point. Communism is authoritarian in nature, as it seeks to disempower the individual and strip them of their property rights, in favour of the collective.
As for socialism, it depends what you mean. Democratic socialism, which is what Western countries practise, is democratic. Socialism is:
a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
This is incompatible with democracy. Democracy requires rule of law and property rights as a foundation. Stripping people of their property rights is authoritarian. It cannot be maintained under a democracy as individuals in the West would vote for their liberty, as they do today. This necessitates authoritarian control.
I would also contend that the outcomes for those living under communism are vastly inferior to those living under capitalism.
The notion that there are no corruption issues in capitalist countries is also bizarre. Are you perpetually anglo-brained in that you only think of the western imperial core when you think about “capitalism”? You are ignoring most of the world.
20million people die to easily preventable things under capitalism around the world every single year. Hunger, clean water, curable disease. Things that we can solve immediately with the resources we already have simply by having leadership that decides to do so. The fact you think this is reasonable is frankly disgusting.
You’re wrong. Socialism objectively provides a higher physical quality of life to its citizens when compared to capitalism at an equal level of development.
That’s a pretty big switcheroo there. Communism isn’t socialism, and the socialism as described in the link is called democratic socialism. I.e. democracy with redistribution. Which all Western countries practise. Your link reinforces my premise.
The notion that there are no corruption issues in capitalist countries is also bizarre.
Nobody claimed that. You keep making up straw men. We’d have a more productive discussion if you just replied to what I wrote.
20million people die to easily preventable things under capitalism around the world every single year.
That the rate of hunger has dropped precipitously while population has exploded in the most impoverished regions is testament to the incredible achievement of capitalism. Child mortality is at an all time low. You’re arguing that because things aren’t perfect, capitalism is bad. Clearly the world isn’t so black and white. No system of resource allocation is perfect, least of all communism.
But really this isn’t about capitalism. It’s about politics. We can choose to tax people more and redistribute locally and abroad. We choose that when we vote. Capitalism just ensures we have lots of resources and products and services.
That’s a pretty big switcheroo there. Communism isn’t socialism, and the socialism as described in the link is called democratic socialism. I.e. democracy with redistribution. Which all Western countries practise. Your link reinforces my premise.
This is ideological illiteracy. Socialism is the transitionary stage between capitalism and communism. All communist states have been socialist states because no society has progressed far enough to reach communism.
Nobody claimed that. You keep making up straw men. We’d have a more productive discussion if you just replied to what I wrote.
The implication was that it is worse in communist countries.
That the rate of hunger has dropped precipitously while population has exploded in the most impoverished regions is testament to the incredible achievement of capitalism. Child mortality is at an all time low. You’re arguing that because things aren’t perfect, capitalism is bad. Clearly the world isn’t so black and white. No system of resource allocation is perfect, least of all communism.
Take China out of that data and it practically flatlines. It has not improved in capitalist countries, China is responsible for almost all of it.
But really this isn’t about capitalism. It’s about politics. We can choose to tax people more and redistribute locally and abroad. We choose that when we vote. Capitalism just ensures we have lots of resources and products and services.
If that were fucking possible under capitalism it would ALREADY BE HAPPENING. The parties presented to you under BOURGEOISE DEMOCRACY are BOURGEOISE parties. They are not parties of the people, they are parties of the bourgeoisie and the entire system is designed to maintain that. When your only options are parties of the bourgeoisie the outcome is that the winner represents the bourgeoisie.
The only solution to this problem is to overthrow the existing bourgeoise democracy and install a proletarian democracy instead, the result of which being that all the parties under the proletarian democracy represent the proletariat. This is what a socialist state is institutionally. The antithesis of a capitalist state institutionally.
