This is ideological illiteracy. Socialism is the transitionary stage between capitalism and communism. All communist states have been socialist states because no society has progressed far enough to reach communism.
You claim me to be “ideologically illiterate,” then go on to agree with me that socialism isn’t communism. That doesn’t speak well of your reading comprehension or intentions.
The implication was that it is worse in communist countries.
I didn’t make any claims about corruption. My claims are with outcomes, which I maintain are worse under communism.
Take China out of that data and it practically flatlines. It has not improved in capitalist countries, China is responsible for almost all of it.
Child mortality has trended down over the last century in almost every capitalist nation, not just China. Even the really corrupt African nations.
If that were fucking possible under capitalism it would ALREADY BE HAPPENING.
No, and this is the central argumentative failure under this dogma. Maybe people just don’t want mass redistribution? Maybe what you want isn’t what everyone else wants? Is that really so hard to accept as a possible reality? The Frankfurt School accepted this in the 1930s under the premise that “people’s lives are just too good under capitalism to ever want to move to communism.”
You claim me to be “ideologically illiterate,” then go on to agree with me that socialism isn’t communism. That doesn’t speak well of your reading comprehension or intentions.
Two sides of the same coin. Socialists all understand that socialism is the transitionary stage between capitalism and communism.
I didn’t make any claims about corruption. My claims are with outcomes, which I maintain are worse under communism.
Prove it. I cited research that shows you are wrong, you’re simply ignoring the facts.
Child mortality has trended down over the last century in almost every capitalist nation, not just China. Even the really corrupt African nations.
Wow one data point! Incredible. Now do deaths from starvation, lack of clean water and curable disease. 20million die per year.
No, and this is the central argumentative failure under this dogma. Maybe people just don’t want mass redistribution? Maybe what you want isn’t what everyone else wants? Is that really so hard to accept as a possible reality? The Frankfurt School accepted this in the 1930s under the premise that “people’s lives are just too good under capitalism to ever want to move to communism.”
Holy shit your argument is “I don’t want to save people’s lives so it’s ok”. Colonial mentality.
Two sides of the same coin. Socialists all understand that socialism is the transitionary stage between capitalism and communism.
We continue to agree: they are not the same. Particularly democratic socialism.
Prove it. I cited research that shows you are wrong, you’re simply ignoring the facts.
The cited research relied on national reported statistics in its methodology. North Korea just isn’t a reliable source. Neither is China; which, by the way, is also classified as a socialist country. Further, the researchers normalised income, which radically altered the conclusion. Without doing that, the capitalist countries win by a country mile. You would have known that had you actually read the study you cited.
To defend my premise, I would like like to cite all former and current communist countries, including:
Korea, Democratic Peoples Rep. (North Korea)
Armenia
Azerbaijan
China
Georgia
Kazakhstan
Kyrgyzstan
Laos, Peoples Democratic Republic
Mongolia
Nepal
Tajikistan
Tibet
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Armenia
Azerbaijan
China
Georgia
Kazakhstan
Kyrgyzstan
Laos, Peoples Democratic Republic
Mongolia
Nepal
Russia
Tajikistan
Tibet
Turkmenistan
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Europe
Albania
Belarus
Bosnia & Herzegovina (Yugoslavia)
Bulgaria
Croatia (Yugoslavia)
Czech Republic (Czechoslovakia)
Estonia
Finland
Germany (German Democratic Republic)
Greece
Hungary
Latvia
Lithuania
Macedonia, FYR (Yugoslavia)
Moldova
Montenegro (Yugoslavia)
Poland
Romania
Serbia (Yugoslavia)
Slovakia (Czechoslovakia)
Slovenia (Yugoslavia)
Spain
Ukraine
Angola
Ethiopia
Mozambique
Colombia
Cuba
Nicaragua
Peru
Most of these countries are doing much better since eliminating communism. The data is irrefutable.
Wow one data point! Incredible. Now do deaths from starvation, lack of clean water and curable disease. 20million die per year.
I literally cited global hunger rates. I encourage you to read my comments above to refresh your memory.
Global access to clean water has been trending up for more than a century.
Disease burden from communicable, maternal, neonatal & nutritional diseases.
I could do this all day, but you made the claim. Let’s see some evidence that capitalist nations do worse than communist nations.
Holy shit your argument is “I don’t want these people to live so it’s ok”. Colonial brained monster.
Once again, creating straw men. No one argued for killing anyone. Do you do his because your argument is weak? Does that normally work for you?
We continue to agree: they are not the same. Particularly democratic socialism.
Does not exist in practice. Democratic socialists are people that believe that socialism can be achieved by winning within bourgeoise-democracy without revolution. They have been murdered by the bourgeoisie whenever they come close to that. I strongly suggest reading the Jakarta Method and also listening to Allende’s last words broadcast via radio while the airforce were bombing the bridges as the US-backed coup raged around him.
democratic socialist countries like the U.S
Holy fucking shit you just called the US “democratic socialism”? We’re done here. You are uneducated and completely out of your fucking mind and have no idea what any of these words mean. I’m not wasting my time anymore.
