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11 points

Wait so is… uhhh how? Like you’re literally not allowed to live somewhere unless you own it?? What about short term rentals and vacations? Or is the idea that we live in some kinda socialist utopia where homes are just idk assigned to people via lottery?

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17 points

There are plenty of mechanisms that can be employed (as there already are in many countries) to ensure profit is not made from essential living. You either own or have strict rent control which tends to mean many properties are publicly owned. Recreational stay is different, it is part of a hospitality industry which provides an additional service on top of what fundamental housing provides.

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11 points

Hotels exist for a reason, and they involve actual labour and upkeep

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9 points

In theory the same is true for a landlord who is expected to maintain the homes they are renting out.

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7 points

The thought that homes don’t require upkeep is insane. I’ve lived in my home for just five years and have spent tens of thousands in just maintenance alone.

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2 points

That would probably mean that the pay is much less unless the maintenance is required every other day

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2 points
*

Yes, but you don’t pay a landlord and a cleaner and a plumber the same, why?

Because they derive value not from their labour but from supply and demand, thus those who own assets derive value primarily from the rarity of such assets. This pressure for increasing rarity is why capitalism is a failure where the overall trend is downward, where the few hoard assets they get off other assets, and the masses who trade in their labour have that labour become increasingly less and less valuable.

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6 points

So is someone supposed to rent a hotel room for 3 years when they move away from their home town to go to college?

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5 points
*

No, all housing should be publicly owned to prevent landlordism and accumulation of capital, so where you will be moving from and moving to will all be owned socially regardless, the way you pick which housing you will use as your personal property for that period of time or any period of time does not have to change at all from how it is now: a website.

That’s the ideal. For the time being, we should have more social housing and levy massive taxes on landlords, forcing them to either sell and turn that to social housing, taking it off the “market” permanently or pay enormous taxes that: 1) Fund socialized housing, 2) Make purchasing properties as investments unprofitable and 3) Fund building more (alongside nationalizing construction).

I used the words “socialize”, “nationalized” and “publicly owned” interchangeably here. The answers differ on who you ask, but the above is what we should be doing, IMO.

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3 points

Believe it or not, yes, this is what people used to do before the early 1900s

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1 point

We call it a “dormitory” instead of a “hotel”, but yes.

Alternatively, they can buy a house, or a share of a house, and sell that house/share when they leave.

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7 points

The idea would be that you don’t get to own somebody else’s home. Why on earth do you equate that with not getting to exist somewhere on vacation?

Instead of looking for gotchas, why not imagine how that would work without someone at the top demanding a passive income?

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13 points
*

Okay, I’ll bite. I own a house. Now suppose I buy another house. It’s empty. It’s not someone else’s home. Under the proposed rule (“you don’t get to own somebody else’s home”), I can’t rent the house-shaped building to someone as a residence. So now instead, I’m turning the second house into a pig farm and hiring laborers to raise and slaughter pigs on it, because the state insists that I have to put the land to work. [That’s what property tax is.]

I’m still profiting off of someone else’s labor, the would-be tenant is homeless, and I’m destroying a neighborhood. Somehow this doesn’t seem like a win to me–for anyone.

I am strongly in favor of protections for tenants: no one should be constructively evicted, rents should be controlled everywhere, and price-fixing by landlord cartels should result in prison sentences. BUT rental residences arise as a natural consequence of the freedom to contract. The solution to slumlords who fund entire generations of descendents by lucking into a valuable tower at the turn of the century is not “getting rid of landlords.” It’s just tax.

Full disclosure: I’m not a landlord, but I’ve both rented and am fortunate enough to own my own home now. I have also litigated both sides of evictions. I’ve seen bad landlords put the screws to impoverished tenants, and I’ve also seen spiteful tenants utterly destroy properties with essentially no recourse. This is not a problem you solve with magical thinking.

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2 points

I’d imagine zoning would restrict this scenario in many cases.

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0 points

Just because you can’t rent it doesn’t mean you can’t use it as part of an investment vehicle. You can offer a private mortgage or land contract, for example. In either case, the occupant of the property is the deed holder. The terms of the agreement are permanent, and established from the start. You can’t arbitrarily increase the cost year after year. They earn equity from day one. You earn interest on the value borrowed from you.

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5 points

State-owned housing, or housing cooperatives.

Even in a Socialist system, it would not be “utopia” or other such idealistic nonsense. It would be similar to current housing markets, just without a profit motive and thus a desire to satisfy needs over gaining income. Much lower rent costs (maintenance and building new housing), but you still apply for housing based on availability.

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3 points

Even without going full ‘free housing for everyone’ utopia, it would be nice if the rent students currently pay to landlords was recoverable when the space is no longer needed. The same way people paying mortgages can just sell their house even before it is fully paid off. We wouldn’t need to drastically reshape society in order to allow people to invest in their own futures rather than shovelling most of what they have into a landlord’s pocket.

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2 points

Don’t let the fire get too close to your straw man, there.

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-2 points
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Homes could just be part of the commons.

Or coop based housing.

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-3 points

That’s why hotels exist

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-7 points

If we lived in a socialist utopia we wouldn’t have to criticise landlords. Your arguement doesn’t even rise to the level of sophistry.

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