You are viewing a single thread.
View all comments View context
17 points

Until you prove that you can’t prove that the system you made up works.

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

Nobody is practically concerned with the “incompleteness” aspect of Gödel’s theorems. The unprovable statements are so pathological/contrived that it doesn’t appear to suggest any practical statement might be unprovable. Consistency is obviously more important. Sufficiently weak systems may also not be limited by the incompleteness theorems, i.e. they can be proved both complete and consistent.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Oh, what if the Riemann hypothesis is such a statement then? Or any other mathematical statement. We may not have any use for them now, but as with all things math, they are sometimes useful somewhere unexpected.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

It’s extremely unlikely given the pathological nature of all known unprovable statements. And those are useless, even to mathematicians.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

I think the statement “this system is consistent” is a practical statement that is unprovable in a sufficiently powerful consistent system.

Can you help me understand the tone of your text? To me it sounds kinda hostile as if what you said is some kind of gotcha.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Just explaining that the limitations of Gödel’s theorems are mostly formal in nature. If they are applicable, the more likely case of incompleteness (as opposed to inconsistency) is not really a problem.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Then it doesn’t work

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

No, see Gödels Incompleteness theorem

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points

It’s very counter intuitive. As the other commenter suggested I was referring to Gödel and his incompleteness theorem.

Actually if the system you made up doesn’t work it would be possible to prove that it does inside that system as you can prove anything inside a system that doesn’t work.

That is why my comment is not entirely accurate it should actually be: Until you prove that if the system works you can’t prove that the system works.

Can you spot the difference in the logic here?

permalink
report
parent
reply

Science Memes

!science_memes@mander.xyz

Create post

Welcome to c/science_memes @ Mander.xyz!

A place for majestic STEMLORD peacocking, as well as memes about the realities of working in a lab.



Rules

  1. Don’t throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.
  2. Keep it rooted (on topic).
  3. No spam.
  4. Infographics welcome, get schooled.

This is a science community. We use the Dawkins definition of meme.



Research Committee

Other Mander Communities

Science and Research

Biology and Life Sciences

Physical Sciences

Humanities and Social Sciences

Practical and Applied Sciences

Memes

Miscellaneous

Community stats

  • 13K

    Monthly active users

  • 3.4K

    Posts

  • 83K

    Comments