No joke here. I just think stuff like this is interesting.
Oh yes, Americans really are the most sarcastic people on the planet and their humor is oh so dark.
Sincerely,
—A Brit.
We are.
It’s what happens when you take dry British humor, concentrate it like a cup of tea run in the microwave until almost all of the water evaporates out and add daily mortal risk from our fellow countrymen.
-A ‘Murica
I wondered why your name struck me as familiar.
Which order is your favorite and why?
Truthwatchers would be my first choice because I like to understand the true nature of things, to create new things, and that power should be wielded carefully and with proper intention.
I think Dustbringers fits my tinkerer and strong feelings about the concept that those with greater power need to exercise greater control.
You?
Dutch humor and jokes are pretty dark, as are half of the swear words.
probably from living next to the Germans. But hey, most of the jokes these days are still about Belgians
Half my family is dutch and many of my friends are full blooded, right off the boat dutch. Dutch humor can be so blunt and expertly delivered that it can literally cut you to the core if you arent accustomed. The only way i can describe it is if you have ever eaten dutch liquorice. Try a piece of dubbel zoute drop and you will understand everything you need to know about the dutch.
But lets give some credit to the hispanics though. Mexican humor, especially with their nicknames, can be exceptionally ruthless as well. Their directness and humor has absolutely got to be on par with the best of the swamp germans.
One of my Dutch friends explained to me that many of Dutch’s darker swear words and related expressions tend to be derived from ruinous diseases. One of them roughly translating to something akin to, “I hope you catch the plague”. Can you corroborate that?
It was part of a greater discussion about the roots of cultural differences. The Netherlands have a much more persistent memory of the era of plague and thus their taboos derive from it. Here in the US, less so.
We curse with pus (etter), tbc (tering), cholera (kolere), plague (pest) and more recently cancer (kanker). Although that often hits a bit too close home for some people. There’s more that I’m forgetting right now. I have heard people describe something bad as being AIDS. So new ones are actually being added.
One of the theories is that it came from Yiddish where diseases are also used as curses. Another popular theory is that because the Dutch population isn’t very religious we switched to diseases because that’s whst we feared in stead of God. The truth lays probably somewhere in the middle.
I m french and I trough that we were the most sarcastic. I think it really depend of the language that you understand the most.
I’m neither British nor American, and whole-heartedly agree.
Stephen Fry on the difference between American and British comedy
Also made me think of a few of Mitchell & Webb’s skits. Like Kill all the poor
I can’t tell if he’s being sarcastic or not.
Americans are also known for being really direct (YMMV; southerners are a lot more indirect, where West Coasters would much rather that you just tell them to get fucked than pretend that you like them). OTOH, from my experience hosting students from East Asia, they tend to be at the opposite end of directness. It took us half the school year to get the kid from Hong Kong to open up, start talking and joking without being prompted and be comfortable telling us mildly uncomfortable things (like if he was unhappy about something). We’ve had two Japanese students as well, and it’s always been a constant struggle to get them to tell us if there’s a problem; they prefer to reach out to a program supervisor instead of telling us directly, and one of them was so bad about indirectness that it felt like he was constantly lying to us. It turns out that differences in directness cause a lot more issues than I would have guessed.
Utah is extraordinarily passive aggressive. Home in New York, I was considered tactful with my words. Here in Utah, I’m considered rude.
People raised here, especially Mormons, will lie to your face with no remorse in order to avoid saying any “harsh” words or causing “contention.”
I’ve pretty stopped being tactful and have embraced vulgar honesty. Not to hurt others - I really do care about my roommates and most of my coworkers on my shift - but to make my thoughts so motherfuckingly clear that even a god-damned inbred Mormon pioneer worshipping dumbass can understand.
I’ve heard this called a “West Coast Attitude”, though AFAICT, it seems like the Northeast also has a reputation for not mincing words. Anyway, yeah, I’m a big fan of the West Coast Attitude; you always feel pretty good that you know where you stand with someone. There’s people out here in Cali that fall in love with the south after a little visit and gush about how nice everyone is. I make it a point to tell them that, as someone who lived a good decade or so in the south, I know that 4 times out of five, that niceness is a facade papering over a whole lot of shit they talked about you the second the door hit your ass. In all fairness, there really are some super great people there that genuinely are as nice as they seem, but I found it hard to tell them apart without getting to know them first.
Northeast is direct, but just won’t say anything until less it’s a big problem. Except NY/NJ assholes.
Midwesterners want to talk all the time to everyone, but mostly niceties.
Southerners are talkative and sound nice too, but can be super backhanded about it.
Westerners are more talkative than New Englanders, and blunt like them at the same time.
— Midwesterner who moved to New England 40 years ago, and has family from NC and CA.
I have a similar experience being from the North and moving to Texas some time ago. At work in the North, I was well spoken, direct, honest, friendly, and kind. In Texas, I spoke my mind too much and wasn’t nice, but was considered a dependable hard worker. The only people that didn’t file HR complaints? Other Northerners.
Culture shock in your own country is a hell of a thing.
Americans are also known for being really direct
Maybe in America. They are also known for saying “this is the best XYZ I’ve ever had in my entire life!!!” for every XYZ they ever have in their entire lives.
Again, Your Mileage May Vary. People in the south can be frustratingly indirect because they believe it’s polite. Broad strokes, however, Americans do tend to be more on the direct side of things; I reckon we’re a little behind Germany (as the exemplar of extreme directness), but much closer to them in directness than we are to, say, England.
Dutch people are the undisputed champions of telling you shit to your face.
Probably more than a little behind Germany. I remember coming across an article about communication pitfalls in the business world that stem from Americans being indirect and using a lot of stock phrases for courtesy.
I remember well-known examples like “how are you” not expressing an interest in how the other person is doing. Or more obscure stuff like “we should meet for coffee soon” expressing not an intention to meet in the near future but a generally positive disposition towards the other person. Or them giving a positive response when someone suggests something they don’t want and relying on nonverbal cues to convey their disapproval.
Perhaps it’s proximity but as a German I find British indirectness (which often revolves around obvious understatement or sarcasm) to be easier to parse than American indirectness (which revolves around stock phrases). Americans can be a bit Darmok if you’re not familiar with a phrase. Thankfully online communication doesn’t feature them as much.
I reckon we’re a little behind Germany (as the exemplar of extreme directness)
??
I live in a very direct culture, but that does not mean we’re being impolite towards each other. I work with a lot of immigrants from cultures which do not separate these two concepts, however, and when you tell them to be more direct, or if they are not getting anywhere by merely hinting at what they need, they quickly switch to:
- frowning
- shouting, or talking very loud
- using very short sentences, as if they were ordering people around
- being borderline insulting
And that is not acceptable in any society. I was absolutely miffed by this many times until I understood that they don’t actually know communication which is both direct AND polite because they didn’t grow up with it.
I put together a quick illustration to show what I mean:
So, the people I’m talking about go from top left to bottom right, maybe brushing on bottom left, because that’s the only direction they know.
I’ve heard from multiple expats living in Japan that Japanese people just do not recognize sarcasm at all and just react as if the person is completely serious.
I think it’s more in the delivery. Some things that might also sound sarcastic in English can also just sound insulting in Japanese so directly translating won’t work like that. There’s also the matter that, no matter which language, both parties are presumably non-native-level in opposite languages which makes processing information and delivery harder.
I’ve been in Japan almost a decade now.
you mean like creating horror by unneccesary brutal force to someone else like all the world would just be a game would NOT be funny to japanese people as it is to the us ppl who enjoy doing so calling it sarcasm or dark humor?
forget about the us! tell me more about those great japanese people living in a country way greater than the us could ever be (at least during that occupation of white brutish -once british- invaders), i already like them more than the us ppl by the way they don’t ‘joke’ about victims of terror, war crimes and such!
I mean, there is sarcasm and dark humor here in Japan. It doesn’t always work in the same way, however.
There’s a ton of it. But it takes a long time to learn how exactly to express it well, and some people don’t like it at all.
So to all the language learners, don’t use sarcasm until years after after you can understand when others are using it.
Or use it, and have trouble making friends. Either way.
