I’m sort of the opposite. I liked Joplin but found myself needing the features of Obsidian. I do know what you mean about Obsidian getting in the way. While it’s easy to start using it, there is a bit of a learning curve to using it well. And it can be a little quirky-annoying at times.
I think that’s one reason there are so many software offerings in this space. There’s a wide range of preferences when it comes to features vs simplicity.
For me, Obsidian is just about perfect without any extensions, but I’m also glad it is extensible if you need them. The configurability and customization, while using standard markup, and keeping the vault storage sizes small were the major pros for me.
Some other products I’ve tried in this space were just too much for me. Huge save files, overdone UXs, and proprietary formats. Joplin and Obsidian were both a breath of fresh air when I found them.
Obsidian is great; I was a happy user for a couple years. But I recently switched to Logseq and I think I’m already liking it more, and it’s because of something Logseq doesn’t do.
Obsidian lets you write a full markdown file, so step one is deciding how to write something down. Is it a nested list? Or a table? Or headings and subheadings with paragraphs?
In Logseq, everything is a nested list. This feels like a limitation, but I’ve been preferring it. The decision is made for you: you’re going to jot this information down as a list. So then you just start writing it.
People often tout that Logseq is open source, and while that is great, IMO there is also a design consideration that makes it better. Pretty much any kind of information you want to write down can be represented as a nested list. Doing it that way keeps everything simple, consistent, and more searchable. (Logseq’s built-in querying feature seems to be more powerful than Obsidian’s Dataview plugin, although I can’t say much about it since I haven’t really played with it yet.)
Both Obsidian and Logseq save (kinda) standard markdown files, so if you spend a lot of time in a plain text editor, you can still use that. You don’t lose anything by editing a file in a separate editor – they will both parse and re-index the file next time you view it in the respective app.
Logseq is the only note taking system that has clicked with me, by lowering the mental overhead at the time of adding notes. I just throw it in there without any considerations while still feeling like it’s not going to get lost. Later I may revisit the day’s journal and add tags or connect other information, move a block into its own page, etc.
In Logseq, everything is a nested list. This feels like a limitation, but I’ve been preferring it. The decision is made for you: you’re going to jot this information down as a list. So then you just start writing it.
Oh - this sounds interesting.
Whenever I needed to jot down any notes I’ve been finding myself just writing plain .txt files with bullet points, and trying tools like Obsidian or TiddlyWiki I always ended up being overwhelmed with the amount of stuff I could do (and with all the customization options) that I never got around to actually writing things down. I’m definitely gonna look into how Logseq works.
(Although I have to say, their website does look a bit “too hype-y” for my liking. IDK how to explain it, just a gut feeling. Still, at least it’s FOSS so it can’t be too bad)
The website also put me off, I only kept at it because my partner was already using it and it looked solid enough. I even asked “Are you sure this is the logseq? It looks so…idk Marketing?”
But so far I just seem to use it a lot, and the more I use it the more useful I find it, especially after learning how to add tags (didn’t seem particularly obvious in the docs), and after finally getting into the flow of using Syncthing.
In Logseq, everything is a nested list. This feels like a limitation, but I’ve been preferring it. The decision is made for you: you’re going to jot this information down as a list. So then you just start writing it.
I really appreciate you posting this. I’m a long-time Obsidian user, and an Evernote user before that, and I never “got” Logseq. I just couldn’t understand what people saw in an app that didn’t let you “write” anything. I’ve tried to start using Logseq so many times and just given up because the interface made no sense.
Thanks to your comment I finally get it! I prefer to be using something open-source, so I’m going to give Logseq another go, now that I finally understand it, and see how that approach feels.
my situation is very similar to yours; I was previously an obsidian user but then switched to logseq for everything. I really wonder why logseq website doesn’t hype up the fact that it’s an outliner, because imo that’s what sets it apart from similar programs. I didn’t even know what an outliner was until recently
CherryTree is way clunkier, IMO, and has too many irrelevant options that get in the way, particularly around formatting. Obsidian is just markdown, so you don’t have the option of spending 15 minutes trying to figure out why code blocks are showing up as dark text on light background even though you’re in dark mode, which was my last experience in CherryTree. Looking and cross referencing documents is also super easy; I’m not sure if CherryTree even does that.
Kinda surprised I had to scroll this far down to find logseq. I’ve started using it in university and it’s been a life saver. I love the idea that everything is in these nested blocks, so I can just hammer down notes about whatever super quick with no setup or thinking about it. I just plunk my laptop down, open it up and go to town.
Trilium for a database and therefore faster method that is actually foss.
Obsidian is reaching market criticality so I’m expecting enshitification any time now.
Obsidian is reaching market criticality so I’m expecting enshitification any time now.
You could be right, but I’m not 100% sure of that. From the article:
Keeping the team small and spurning outside investment is Obsidian’s way of avoiding incentives that might lead the company astray.
If they can stick to that, they can avoid going downhill. The main driver for enshittification is big shareholders that want the company to keep growing – shareholders don’t care about stable profitability, they need growth for their ownership stake to increase in value. If Obsidian is profitable now and they’re fine with just keeping it that way, they can make it work.
The driver of enshittification is extracting money from your user base and investors alike. Lacking one doesn’t stop it.
If I was going to trust obsidian, their code would be fully foss. Since it isn’t, there is nothing future proofing my notes in their software. Might as well switch now to something which largely works better and is more feature rich.
Might as well switch now to something which largely works better and is more feature rich.
Which is relative to personal taste and needs.
If I was going to trust obsidian, their code would be fully foss.
I definitely agree that I wish it was fully foss, but i also think it is a far better option than notion, onenote, etc for most people (as long as it meets their needs and preferences) since with obsidian you do actually own your data and you don’t need to pay unless you want their sync.
Since it isn’t, there is nothing future proofing my notes in their software.
Even if, worst case, Obsidian enshitifies, all the notes are markdown or json (json for config and things that don’t work in markdown, but the community and the devs work hard to keep that to a minimum) so you can still access your stuff in any text editor and it will be fairly easy to get the important data migrated into anything else. (I often use vs code to manage my notes, for instance, esp for big find and replace or re-org tasks) Even the non-standard markdown from obsidian and the most popular plugins reads well and could fairly easily be replicated with remarked or other markdown libraries. In this way, i think Obsidians approach is far superior to a tool which uses a database to store its data, since a database would require some effort to use standalone, or some work to migrate it to another tool or some sort of minimal client interface.
By its design, Obsidian could also be replaced by reverse engineering their api. If obsidian takes the dark path, we will probably see a foss community grow from the plugin dev community to replace it and be as compatible with plugins as possible, even if its just the basic text and display components. Tbh, it could totally be a vs code plugin, an emacs mode, [insert any text editor with plugins here]… thats how portable the data is. The obsidian devs know this, and they are intentional about staying this way. A shift in attitude here would be noticed by the community very quickly.
It’s completely markdown which is future-proof and easily portable to other software
I’ve recently switched from Notion to Obsidian (almost anyway). But I still have to find a good way to sync. I tried nextcloud, but I couldn’t get two way sync to work on mobile. I feel like €10,- a month for just sync is a bit much, and it (partly) defeats the idea of “the files are mine”.
I wish the official sync software was available for self hosting (ie as a Docker container). Maybe even against a one time fee?
What solutions do others here use for syncing?
I use syncthing, it is great for folder syncthing between multiple devices and no “server” needed
Pros:
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bullet proof
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Simple
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FOSS
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Selfhosted
Cons:
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password/secrets manager nearly required to setup new devices
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fails to make my morning coffee
Amazing, sync has been holding me back from adopting Obsidian. I’ve been tooling around with Nextcloud Notes/Quillpad thus far and while it works, it has its limits - especially since I like to link my notes to one another. This might actually be the thing that finally gets me to switch. Thank you for sharing.
If you’re in the Apple ecosystem, you can toss your vault into iCloud Drive. If you’re technically proficient (and brave) you can write a cron to sync into whichever service you want via a local machine.
In addition to iCloud, I have a one-way sync (rsync) which functions as a poor man’s backup to get all my files into Dropbox; lots of stern warnings from Obsidian not to use Dropbox.
My sync setup, working perfectly, and using Obsidian on all 3 devices almost daily. YMMV.
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Desktop (Mac): Google Drive
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Chromebook (installed as Linux app): Google Drive
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Phone (Android): AutoSync for Google Drive. Bought paid version just to support them, don’t think it was necessary. $5, got to spend my Google Play Credit 😊👍
They make some great RPGs ;P
