Leaks confirm low takeup for Windows 11::Time to rethink Windows 10 support cycle then?
“Windows 11 is simply OK. There’s nothing particularly wrong with it except for its hardware requirements.”
Wtf? It’s just ok? It’s a resource hog, excelling at one thing: spyware implementation.
Have you seen the new Taskbar? It has the functionality of a wooden stick. They even had to make a damn patch to put the “Start Task Manager” option back in the context menu! They fucked up the menus and now everything is just “several hundred clicks away”.
And their constant push for subscription based shit is just annoying like hell.
L.E. typo
Linux Desktop is the future, might as well start to get familiar with it now, why wait?
Just like Linux is the great leader in server space.
That comment in the article made me wonder how long this person has been using computers, and whether he has seen anything other than Windows 10 and 11. If you’ve only seen 10, then 11 seems like a bland, slightly shittier OS, but if you have a broader experience you probably find 11 to be a bloated, slow, ad ridden piece of crap.
I still think 10 is a waste of space and would be using only linux or 7 if not for gamepass (old distant friends have xboxes only). I still run 7 on my living room PC and its honestly a better experience then 10. If not for end of life (that lets face it are mostly arbitrary at this point) there is little reason to upgrade, even the few things not in things 7 or 10 (like auto HDR support or new Direct X) are simply withheld for no reason and often people have worked out how make it work anyway.
I am old enough to remember how each new windows addressed a flaw in the last (even if that flaw was made up). Here is off the top of my head some examples (leaving out the better NT line) :
- Windows 95: Upgrade from 3.1 in most ways, first time dos was really secondary.
- Windows 98: Much better USB support and more “plug and play”
- Windows ME: Fixed the issue of people having hard drive space.
- Windows XP: Massive upgrade in supported hardware, usability etc.
- Windows Vista: People thought this sucked (it did) but the main reason was that it (and x64 XP) supported more then 4 gigs of ram.
- Windows 7: Was not Vista and much more efficient.
- Windows 8: Fixed the perceived flaw that your PC should really be a phone for some reason?
- Windows 9: DAMN IT MICROSOFT LEARN TO COUNT!
- Windows 10: Was not a Phone OS. Things like gamepass are supported. Told this was the last windows.
Genuinely I’ll give Michaelsoft credit on skipping 9, they did that to avoid SEO poisoning windows 9x variants.
What? if that was a good enough reason to skip 9 they could have called it something else. What happened was that marketing said 10 is cooler.
The did name it something else. They named it 10. A lot of programs had checks for windows version looking for 9 for 95/98 which would cause issues without updates. So it’s better to avoid it altogether.
I’m sorry but as someone who remembers Win 3.0 I have to say that Win 95 was a fucking revelation when it came out. The taskbar with star menu paradigm made many a man cross their legs.
You skipped 2k, the first NT intended for consumer use. If you ask me it’s been downhill ever since, some security stuff they added certainly makes sense but 2k was the last actually coherent OS Microsoft published. Oh they also added search which is useful because who the fuck can find settings nowadays, how many different interfaces to various settings does Windows 10 have? Twenty?
My theory is that after 98 windows started to follow the “this one shit, next one good” pattern. ME was shit, XP was great, Vista was shit, 7 was great, 8 was shit, 10 is good. Obviously 11 is shit and if the pattern holds the next one will be good again.
Microsoft decided to skip Windows 9 because, after doing a lot of research, they found that a lot of commonly used legacy software had implemented compatibility hacks which involved checking for “Windows 9” to detect when the software was running under either Windows 95 or Windows 98.
Instead of breaking a lot of software or requiring a lot of updates (some of which could even be from vendors who were no longer in business) they decided to work around the problem by just skipping straight to 10.
Edit: My mistake, I responded to the wrong comment. But I’m gonna leave it here because I already typed it.
The issue with that theory is that the “good” keep getting worse and the “shits” plumb the depths more and more with each cycle.
They look good when comparing it with the last one but I would say ME (I used ME as a teen I know it) was better then Vista and Vista was better then 8 and 8 was better then 11.
Unless you are willing to switch to linux, suck it up
There is nothing about windows 11 that’s better than on windows 10. Why would anyone switch voluntarily?
Windows 10 at least had better automatic driver installation, touchscreen and multi-monitor support compared to 7, but came with a shitload of ads built right into it. Windows 11 has even more ads, but what does it give you?
Apk support. Saves you having to get LDplayer or something. Would be great if you’re developing android aps.
But yeah the juice isn’t worth the squeeze in this case. I’m not switching till 10 goes eol and even then there’s a strong chance I’ll fully switch to linux instead.
That’s not even a selling point to an android dev. Android emulators already run, and give a better simulation of a physical device. The only reason it’d be useful for android dev is if you’re actually developing an APK for Windows itself.
I did the upgrade so I could have tabbed explorer windows. It was honestly worth it as my work is much more organized.
But even then, it’s still a bit glitchy in a way that should be embarrassing for a company of that size.
You could just buy the program from the windows store and run it in Windows 10 (it’s called Files). Also linux had tabbed file explorers for decades. Glad to see windows finally catch up.
I wish I knew that! I would have stayed with windows 10. Well if I ever need to reformat I’ll switch back.
I’m a long time linux user, but work requires windows or Mac. I’ve tried forever to use Linux for work but there are 2 key pieces of software that do not have a functional alternative on Linux and they don’t run through wine.
I am seeing a “Files App” by “Yair A”, it’s €9 for me. Is that the program you are talking about?
HDR support is a big one for me and the reason I switched. APK support is nice. I like the glassy look although that could be achieved on 10 via other means. The search function feels much better to use and it’s nice because I like to use the search function instead of keeping things on my desktop
Search only feels better in 11 because 10s was so bad. Both of them are pretty bad.
Fair, but I feel my point stands. It’s not like spotlight on Mac, but it actually understands what I want now. I use it mostly to launch programs.
And before someone attacks me: I use all 3 major OSes weekly. Hot takes: Mac doesn’t suck and isn’t incompatible for the majority of tasks, but it does end support for things normal people don’t care about, Linux is not that great when it comes to normal quality of life (not power user stuff, it’s awesome for that), and windows makes things easy to access while somehow making everything behind a million menus and across different menus (but still much easier to change than linux)
How much better is the HDR support in Win11? Does it stop your desktop looking washed out when turned on?
For me it does. I have two HDR monitors, neither with exceptional hdr. Both look much better with it on, but I personally like the HDR look that some things have. I can tell when something is washed out, but my RGB has also not been properly calibrated. Regular HDR modes in games suck and make it look like I’m staring at the sun or an old photo. Auto HDR makes fire look brighter
Yea that has been fixed. And AutoHDR is pretty much a must have if you have a real HDR monitor. (Not that fake hdr400 B’s they put on all monitors nowadays.)
AutoHDR is only available in Windows 11. Granted, HDR uptake on PC monitors has been abysmal, it’s a great feature for the few that might use it.
Does it change the screen’s contrast depending on what’s being displayed? Because my work laptop does that. If there’s a white window on screen, contrast is great. But if I minimize that and just have something dark on screen, it slowly reduces the contrast until I can barely read anything.
I think the VM support is better on Windows 11. I tested gaming on both 10 and 11 on my Linux install and 11 performed better. Otherwise, agreed 11 is a downgrade
I haven’t tried VMs via hyper v but WSL and sandbox seems to work a bit better. I don’t know if it’s quantifiablely better but it feels like runs better.
For linux clients maybe, but definitely not for windows clients. Microsoft practically killed Virtualbox, so we have to use Hyper-V at work now. And unlike virtualbox, it doesn’t let me install my keyboard layout in the VM via MSKLC, which is literally made by microsoft. I had to convert my virtualbox VM where it was installed already and guess what, it works perfectly now.
I also have to disable the keyboard manager in powertoys, another microsoft product, whenever I use the VM because capslock gets stuck on inside the VM if I don’t. That also happens on VMs without my keyboard layout, so it’s a separate issue.
The VM also feels much slower and glitchier than the virtualbox one I used on an older computer.
GUI support is in Win10 as well: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/wsl/tutorials/gui-apps
Tabbed explorer can also be achieved with third party apps (I use QTTabBar).
I guess it has Windows Subsystem for Android, but that’s definitely not a compelling enough feature for most. If you’re so inclined, there’s projects out there to enable it in Win10 as well (https://github.com/MustardChef/WSABuilds)
Windows 10 replaced 7 for most people because 8 was a piece of junk. Windows 7 was old by the time 10 came out so there was pent up demand and 10 was a pretty solid showing.
There’s not much that’s compelling about 11 and they’ve introduced unwanted things. It shouldn’t be surprising that people prefer to stay on 10, which is one of the better operating systems Microsoft has ever released. Combine that with the dominance of Linux in the server space and what seems like increased adoption on the desktop and it’s a recipe for poor numbers. For a lot of developers, it’s easier being on a Linux desktop when Linux is the deployment target.
You forgot Vista. Nobody wanted Vista because it was a piece of junk. 8 was ok, but since 7 was still supported and people hate change they stuck with 7. The worst thing about 8 was the dumb full screen start menu… once that was gone after 8.1 I enjoyed it just fine and was pretty close to windows 10.
Same goes for 11 for me. I don’t mind it, I hate the tracking and built in news and ads but it’s pretty easy to stop a lot of that. I think the thing I hate the most is the small stuff they release for 11 that 10 could easily have but they will never release it for 10. Like tabbed notepad, or window arrangement, and now built in winrar support. I love these things, but hold them back from 10 just to get people to switch without realizing it’s not enough for people to care that much.
Vista was pretty bad. That was another one most people skipped. They had 2 excellent releases prior to that - 2000 and XP - and then shit the bed with Vista. I still think 8 was worse though. But 2000 was my personal favorite Microsoft OS so what the hell do I know.
People seem to forget about how with 8 Microsoft tried to make everything fullscreen squares, the desktop also being a square but by changing settings you can get away with using the “Desktop” square exclusively.
Is there even any actual positive for upgrading? I haven’t heard a single good thing about Windows 11 vs 10
Rounded corners lmao. But actually the UI makes the OS feel more complete and polished compared to Windows 10. You can never know how much you missed out until you try it.
Given that I pretty much only use my windows PC for gaming, I think I’ll pass on upgrading for round corners lol
I actually love Windows 11 personally (no I’m not paid by MS). I get an extra hour of battery life on 11 somehow, and finally like 2 years in the right click menu is getting support from 3rd party apps so it’s not just in the way and is actually nice and fast unlike a bloated legacy right click menu.
Windows 11 has a lot of issues, but most of them are carry overs from windows 10. The same work arounds work for 11 as 10 so if you do an upgrade you don’t even have to deal with them.
Windows 11 Pro is pretty good!
Windows 11 Home is pretty stinky!
I use 11 for work and 10 for my personal usage still.
I’m the same, but I would actually like 11 on my home gaming pc though. I’ve grown tired and sometimes frustrated with 10 after spending so much time with 11 now. 10 feels so clunky at times. And with me using startisback on my 11 pc i would say the whole interface of my 11 pc is way better than my 10 pc
For anyone reading this, you can easily upgrade your windows installation locally for free with “windows activation scripts” (hosted on GitHub).
It even has a oneliner you paste into a command prompt which guides you through.
And yeah it sure sounds shady, but it works great and Microsoft will only get money from selling my data as they would do anyways even if I paid.
Windows 10 replaced 7 for most people because 8 was a piece of junk.
Mostly true; most people who wound up with 8 or 8.1 did so by buying a computer during that brief period of time, few people wanted it, few people liked it, and many people avoided using it. Especially computer enthusiasts did in fact go from 7 to 10.
Windows 7 was old by the time 10 came out so there was pent up demand and 10 was a pretty solid showing.
That’s not how I remember events. When Windows 10 was young it was not very popular; they got a lot of backlash for that “Upgrade to Windows 10! [yes] [not yet]” pop-up that took no answer as a yes and installed the OS on idling computers overnight.
Maybe that was an issue with Windows 10 on the consumer side. I don’t have experience with the home versions. In any case, it was a good upgrade and it provided more secure desktops for most people. On the corporate side, we were pretty happy to go to 10 and it was a smooth process. We had to do it in phases and we got a lot more calls from users wanting to move higher on the list than complaints. There were only a few asking to be last and the only real problem we had was one guy who demanded we buy him a refurbished Surface that had a specific old version of 8 pre-installed because it was “the best version ever”.
I saw in my old line of work that most business over a certain size just have a few key programs that need to work and could not give two shits about whatever new OS was out if it could not run those programs. The fact that in places like the banking sector many of the programs are UNIX era and need emulation just to use on a desktop and not being spied is often a requirement it would make no sense what so ever to upgrade. I have also seen an uptick in Linux and Mac workstations as both are looking more attractive then the wild ride windows has become.
Oh and in case people think security on older OS is a concern for companies I know for a fact that several ATMs in north America are still running on XP (upgraded about 7 years ago from 2000).
banking sector many of the programs are UNIX era
Somewhere in the distance a mainframe sysop with blue tie is protesting that statement but nobody’s hearing him over the noise of the rotating drum.
My last gig was as a CIO in a fairly large organization and we had stringent infosec requirements due to the industry we were in. Old operating systems and software are absolutely an issue, although it still doesn’t stop some companies from running them.
Most of the malware going around exploits patched vulnerabilities. It literally takes seconds and not exactly a high skill level to compromise a machine that’s missing security updates. Regular patching is without a doubt one of the best controls you can have in place. The other big issue was social engineering. If you don’t effectively tackle those two things it doesn’t matter what else you do because you will be breached.
Besides that, you’re mostly right. We were all over the security updates but didn’t care for other upgrades because they introduce instability. It’s the last thing you want with thousands of endpoints and a bunch of shitty enterprise apps. Run it until the wheels fall off or it’s approaching EOL for security updates.
Oh sorry if it came across as old software not being a security issue just that most places don’t care or plan around it (those ATMs running XP are running a very stripped and locked down version).
I remember quite a few places paying extra for a little bit longer for updates just due to how rough the change was going to be. I think most of the time when something did go wrong at a place it was (in this order):
- Social engineering
- Some sort of update that was not tested enough (or at all)
- A new roll out going bad (this happened way more then it should have)
- Hardware failure (often because a sales guy did not know the difference between “redundancy” and “reduced failure rate”
- Actual disaster (I remember getting calls about a bank networking device calling home with fan errors as the building it was in was floating down the river)
