Lubbock County, Texas, joins a group of other rural Texas counties that have voted to ban women from using their roads to seek abortions.
This comes after six cities and counties in Texas have passed abortion-related bans, out of nine that have considered them. However, this ordinance makes Lubbock the biggest jurisdiction yet to pass restrictions on abortion-related transportation.
During Monday’s meeting, the Lubbock County Commissioners Court passed an ordinance banning abortion, abortion-inducing drugs and travel for abortion in the unincorporated areas of Lubbock County, declaring Lubbock County a “Sanctuary County for the Unborn.”
The ordinance is part of a continued strategy by conservative activists to further restrict abortion since the U.S. Supreme Court overturned Roe v. Wade as the ordinances are meant to bolster Texas’ existing abortion ban, which allows private citizens to sue anyone who provides or “aids or abets” an abortion after six weeks of pregnancy.
The ordinance, which was introduced to the court last Wednesday, was passed by a vote of 3-0 with commissioners Terence Kovar, Jason Corley and Jordan Rackler, all Republicans, voting to pass the legislation while County Judge Curtis Parrish, Republican, and Commissioner Gilbert Flores, Democrat, abstained from the vote.
This is incredibly fucked up. Handmaid’s tale was a documentary.
Get ready for highway checkpoints for pregnant women, coming to a red state near you.
“I noticed your had a license plate light out, Ma’am. Please get out of the car and pee on this test strip.”
How tf would they even enforce this?
“Are you traveling to get an abortion?” “No, I’m going to visit family”
How would they prove otherwise? Is there something I’m missing?
Good luck and godspeed using that approach with a rural county sheriff’s office in Texas. No, they cannot enforce this, and you should probably just politely deflect the question and gtfo
" Am I being detained or am I free to go?" If detained “then you shut the fuck up!”
You’re missing the right to privacy in your phone. Make sure you didn’t put the clinic into Google maps or make a call to them ahead of time. Governmental AI is on the way and it will be steered by the same people making these rules.
Just keep a strong password on your phone, and disable biometrics if you’re travelling for abortion.
They can’t compel the password out of you, but they can compel a finger print, or pointing it at your face unlock.
You should look up geofence warrants, that are now very, very common.
They can subpoena google or apple for anyone traveling through their jurisdiction to specific areas.
Quickly tapping or holding the lock button on an iPhone will disable biometric entry until a pin is entered.
If you think they are going to get this info directly off your phone, you are pretty naive. It’s social media where they will harvest this data. Locking your phone is like holding your pinky up to avoid getting wet in a storm.
It basically gives them an excuse to detain any woman they want, which is the purpose.
LEAs have been shown to actively track women who use search engines or messaging services to seek information about abortion services. There’s a non-zero chance that women who they suspect, and their friends and family, are tagged in their system when they search the plates of someone passing by.
It’s not about lying to cops, particularly if they can already prove you were seeking those services in the first place. At that point they’ll arrest you with probable cause.
They already use that kind of system with drug dealers. If they suspect you sell drugs, they will tag your name and plate and find a reason to pull you over if they spot you. Why would they hesitate to track women like that?
It goes like this:
We know you’re traveling to get an abortion, we have your messages and search history. It is illegal to use this highway for that purpose. You are under arrest.
Whether they are correct in issuing an arrest doesn’t matter for them because they have qualified immunity. They let the courts sort it out.
They cannot because they do not have jurisdiction at all. You can’t prosecute someone for doing something legal in another area.
That’s the loophole they’re trying to use. You can’t punish them for the abortion, so you punish them for using public roads for disallowed purposes (driving to abortion). They do have jurisdiction over road use.
They dont really have jurisdiction over road use because of the interstate commerce clause either.
Thats why they claim this bullshit law doesnt cause any conflict, because they aren’t restricting use of the road, they are just “making it easier for private citizens to sue people that help women doing something legal one state over” which is of course restricting use of the road, but pretending its not.
There’s two things that apply in this situation. The first is that like several other states, they’re not making getting an abortion in another state illegal, they’re making traveling on their infrastructure for the purposes of obtaining an abortion in another state illegal. Is that an unconstitutional restriction on interstate commerce? Who the fuck knows anymore? I don’t think it will hold, but I didn’t expect Justice Thomas to rise like Cthulhu from his eternal and well grifted slumber to kill Roe, so I’m not offering an opinion on that.
The second way, and this is also worrying me, is that while they can’t make flying to California to smoke pot illegal, they can make having pot in your system when you land back in Texas illegal. If they can’t make having an abortion in CA illegal, can they still use medical records to track that your pregnancy was terminated out of state, and prosecute you on a charge after returning to the state with a terminated pregnancy?
To be honest, I think that will fail too, but I’m sure it’ll land on the books someplace.
I’m also sure that these will all become national level laws because people still think politics is a team sport, and if it does not terrify you that the worst president in the history of the US and with openly fascist statements of taking full control and going after his enemies is running neck and neck with just a regular pre-2000s style politician, you’re either not paying attention or you’re privileged as all fuck.
This is why I as a Canadian can’t fathom why Americans seem to think they have more freedom than I do somehow. To me the whole “States Rights” debacle essentially gives Americans two countries worth of laws that they are bound by instead of one.
The fact the US also enforces it’s laws on non-citizens for things done outside it’s country legally gives the whole thing the sense of the US being drunk on it’s own sovereignty. Like it’s legal to smoke pot here but if you are tricked into mentioning at a US boarder crossing that you EVER smoked weed on Canadian soil even if it was in the distant past you risk being forever barred from entry into the US.
And to be clear this is not their citizens doing things in their own country that are not illegal by the measure of that country’s law. From what I understand there isn’t much of an appeal process either because once it’s done our citizenry suddenly goes into category “not my monkey not my circus”.
The US is very very fond of restriction of freedoms from an outsider perspective.
I’m not super sure that applies here - they aren’t being punished (legally) for getting the abortion, but for using the roads to get there. It seems to me conceptually similar to how European companies aren’t allowed to sell drugs that are used for lethal injection to the US, even though those drugs are legal to sell in Europe: They aren’t being punished for taking part in an execution that’s legal where it happens, just for doing something that enables it in a place where it isn’t legal. Same deal here.
I’m sure it’s an unconstitutional/illegal law for some other reason, I just don’t think this specific reason applies.
I’m excited to see the faces when this is used to regulate guns.
Sorry sir, but in this here county you can’t take guns out of your yard. To include bringing them in the first place.
The guns that are in your home stay put and your rights are intact.
When pulled over, any interaction beyond what is required by law should be not answered or answered with something along the lines of invoking the 5th. There are a bazillion YouTube lawyers that all the say this.
If you need directions, put in something that isn’t the abortion place, but has it along the way, like a national park or other tourist place, some conference, etc. Then put in the real destination when you get across the border.
These types of laws tend to rely on someone close to the pregnant person calling the cops, usually family. These communities passing these laws are full of people who would eagerly jail their children for getting an abortion.
Just some advice here: don’t answer questions.
A cop pulls you over “I don’t answer questions”, “I’d like to speak to a lawyer.”, “I do not consent to a search.”, “I would like to speak to a lawyer.”
If they keep asking questions. Do not respond with anything other than “I would like to speak to a lawyer.” Be polite; but you are far more likely to incriminate yourself than not.
The more you say, they more they can use against you.
make sure to record without unlocking your phone, if that’s the route you’re going to go. Also. Don’t use biometrics to unlock your phone. Use a pin. Less convenient, sure, but your face/fingerprint is “evidence”, but they can’t compel you to give up your pin.
not that it’s going to do much at all. there’s tools that they can use to crack inside of… moments.
I think it would likely be used to add extra charges after the fact ie did you get caught? Then you must have also commited this crime on top of the others. Then again I might be ascribing logic where there is none.
They could just have checkpoints on the exit roads on the state. There are a lot of things Texas republicans are doing with police, namely allowing them to be border patrol agents with authority to deport people. This, along with precedent being pushed that police can find probable cause after the fact that you’re arrested, police can just arrest first because they saw a women “who looked pregnant.” I foresee women becoming second class citizens really soon in red states, and its really troubling.
Everything else aside, that’s about as clear a violation of the Commerce Clause as you can get.
The inability of states to regulate interstate commerce was settled by the courts in 1824.
The same laws that allows firearms to be shipped through states where they’re illegal protects abortion-seekers on Texas roads
was settled by the courts in 1824.
Nothing is “settled” with the current Supreme Court.
Commerce Clause is about as settled as it can get, though. Especially with a Court so enamoured with Founders Intent. Gibbons v Ogden is probably only behind Marbury v Madison in sacred status to this Court.
It’s cute that you still have faith in conservatives doing anything consistently
“Sorry, but after the gutting of Roe, stare decisis only applies to things conservatives and/or billionaire overlords approve of” – SCOTUS
Something something it’s not commerce because reasons.
Nevermind that the Commerce Clause has been cited to give the federal government authority to prohibit activities that are neither commerce nor inter-state, such as growing cannabis for personal use on your own property.
Schroedinger’s commerce. It’s commerce only when it’s convenient for prohibitionists.
The federal government doesn’t outlaw abortion, so they can’t use the Commerce Clause to enforce abortion restrictions enacted by the states.
However, the issues you cite with them being bullies with the commerce clause are centered on authority granted through Gibbons.
Gibbons was specifically about states trying to enforce laws (specifically state-granted steamboat monopolies) within their borders that had a direct impact on commerce within another state. The Supreme Court declared that a violation of the commerce clause because only the Federal Government can regulate interstate commerce.
Texas passing laws prohibiting travel to another state to seek abortions (which are federally legal) could only be allowed by SCOTUS by overturning Gibbons, which would be absolutely devastating.
That would be by far the most-impactful reversal in the Court’s history, and it can’t be overstated how much of a grenade it would be. Everybody would lose, and the GOP’s owners more than anyone else.
If SCOTUS were insistent (and consistent) that only the federal government had the power to regulate interstate commerce, yet this Texas jurisdiction is trying to do just that, wouldn’t that logically be in violation of the Commerce Clause and SCOTUS would have to strike down?
I was arguing that SCOTUS isn’t consistent on this, but pretend they were.
Why does Texas hate freedom so much?
Texans are some of the most delusional people on the planet.
For some reason, even the democrats there think it’s better than states like Florida. It isn’t.
The only state that is objectively worse than Texas is Louisiana, and that’s saying something.
You clearly don’t know what you’re talking about since you skipped Mississippi, land of waffle House and sadness.
Nah. I skipped Mississippi on purpose. Cheap housing, decent geography, and that’s about it.
More than Texas can say, though.
At least Mississippi doesn’t pretend to be god’s gift to humanity and the greatest nation to ever exist. Texas is high as shit on the smell of its own farts.
I agree, but I’d rather live in Mississippi than Texas.
At least they have cheap housing.
Not nearly as bad as Texas. They have nice beaches, and decent cities.
Shame about the whole swamp and going into the water thing, but it’s still a pretty nice place to be. And of course their politics suck, mostly driven by old people, rich people, and idiots who succumb to them at their own expense.
Doesn’t this run afoul of the commerce clause?
A random ass County can’t ban travel on any roads or highway for any reason, right? That’s strictly the job of congress.
Also I’d like to add:
How about this worthless board look into why there is so much crime in the county before Talibaning travel for women?
Because Lubbock is a meth-infested shithole in the middle of nowhere. The only thing to do there is drugs, alcohol, rape, and domestic violence.
My first thought as well. There is NO way this doesn’t get struck down in a court case. If you can’t even ban guns on streets near schools (US v. Lopez) then you definitely can’t ban a person from driving on a road to get to a medical procedure in a different state.
Have you seen the other decisions made by SCOTUS?
They don’t give a shit about consistency or law or precedent. They are politicians put there to deliver specific outcomes.
They do care about precedent, usually too much in my opinion. There have been many cases in the last few years brought to SCOTUS seeking the overturning of the doctrine of Qualified Immunity, but SCOTUS has in all cases either not taken them up or not ruled on that issue. They basically keep saying, “we’ve already ruled on this, we won’t touch it unless Congress changes the law in some way.” Dobbs was like the one issue SCOTUS has actually overturned a previous opinion on in recent years.
My guess is this is what will doom this law, specifically since they’re also looking at drugs which are certainly commodities from out of state.
It might also be a prior restraint case depending on if traveling to a women’s healthcare provider is protected expression.
Like, the problem for the county here is trying to stop people from doing something they can’t prove they’re actually going to do.
They might be able to plus up other charges based on using county property in the commission of some other “crime” (gigantic air quotes). Sort of like getting extra charges due to using the USPS to commit a crime.
Exactly. They’d have to prove you were specifically going there to get an abortion.
Cops can’t stop you because you were on your way to a bank, just because they feel you might want to rob it. You have to have actually done something illegal in the first place.
Cops can’t stop you because you were on your way to a bank, just because they feel you might want to rob it.
LOL Sure, in theory they can’t, but in reality cops do stop people for any made up reason and they can also shoot you for any made up reason without consequence.
And “pro-life” people will support every cop that kills a pregnant woman on that highway.
