*Edit: I checked some of the stuff more out in detail. While some concepts on this are valid and backed up by sience, others like RSD are not. Use this as a springboard for learning, not as a valid source in itself. Yes it says so in the corner already. But spelling it out might help.
People are more complicated then a diagram from the internet. Never forget that.
Nothing about this is scientific.
Indeed, I would say it’s kind of bollocks. And I’m in at least two of these groups.
What if I have stuff from all three circles
These are all spectrums. Experiencing all of these symptoms is normal. Experiencing these symptoms frequently and with such high degree that it impacts your daily life - that is a disorder.
I am not a doctor. This is not medical advice.
For me (who has all 3) the items on that chart aren’t symptoms. They’re personality traits.
I had suspected being gifted could have helped mask autism and ADHD (a psychiatrist even said “you have a PhD, you do not have ADHD”), but I had never seen it like this and it makes me even more suspicious.
See a different doctor and have them examine you with a spotlight on ADHD symptoms. There’s remarkably few doctors that are good at diagnosing ADHD, especially in certain presentations.
There’s a lot of common misconceptions about ADHD and it’s signs/symptoms, and those misconceptions are not exclusive to people without a PhD. So get a second or third opinion.
I’m on the gifted side, with an more inward presentation of ADHD, it wasn’t until I was 39 that I even spoke to a medical professional about it. I was mediocre in school (often without trying, because I couldn’t focus or sit long enough to do homework or study), and as I’ve gotten older and into my career in a highly technical field, job demands have made it much harder to mask my ADHD symptoms. I started treatment by medication and I’ve been able to sit and focus and do my job better and easier than before. I still have challenges, medication isn’t a cure; medication has simply given me better control over where my focus lies, if I’m not working to direct my energy and focus into the right work, then I’m no better off.
Diagnosis is the first step, so if your doctor isn’t up to speed enough to know the signs and symptoms, find one who is.
Until recently, adult ADHD was not considered to be a thing but evidence has shown that to be very wrong. A lot of people were told that people just grew out of being ADHD, and some do, but not everyone.
Your achievements do not and should not have any bearing on whether you are affected. You can have ADHD and be very well decorated in your achievements, even if you’ve never been properly diagnosed or treated for it.
The main factor here should be whether you think that you may have it, and whether or not having it may be holding you back. Make a choice whether that’s something you believe, and go from there.
This chart hits me hard, in so many ways.
There are certain traits common to neurotypicals which I have always considered to be detrimental to not only that person in whom I’ve observed the trait, but to society as a whole – but because I’m the one who is considered “different” I usually find that it’s easier to just keep my trap shut, rather than be browbeaten by NTs for my strong opinions.
As a very obvious example: “Highly developed morals” is tucked away in the corner of the Autism/Giftedness sub-quadrant. I’m going to make the obvious assumption that Ms. Higgins Lee clearly did not intend to imply that only neurodivergents hold that trait… but, anecdotally, I have nonetheless on more than one occasion observed that far too many people who are considered by the larger populace to be “normal” not only appear to lack that trait, but actively despise anyone who holds such high morals.
NTs so often derisively label us as “autistic” or “neurodivergent” or (my personal favorite) “nerds”… like these are all somehow bad things – but maybe society as a whole needs to reevaluate the entire notion of what constitutes “good” and “bad”.
Sorry… am I being too divergent? Should I shut my trap… yet again?
I think “Highly developed morals” in this context doesn’t mean being a “better” person by following a “superior” code of conduct.
It means a higher chance to follow any established code out of principle - even to one’s own detriment - even with zero chance of getting caught cheating - even without getting to have bragging rights on upholding integrity. (But only if that code is properly understood first and deemed reasonable. Arbitrary BS-rules don’t have that effect) There was a study about it, I think, from Bazil?
You’re probably right – but let’s pick that apart for a bit. What you are basically describing is “doing what’s right when nobody is watching.” How is that not a “superior code of conduct,” as you put it?
Social codes don’t have inherent value. They vary over time, places, culture, etc…
Right and wrong are subjective. You can try to debate for moral absolutism, but I won’t respond.
I was describing “doing what one thinks is expected to be the right choice as defined by code without incentives to do so other than the personal desire to uphold the code by making the choice it suggests”
My best friend is ND (she thinks she’s autistic but hasn’t been diagnosed), I think I’m ND too since I’ve noticed I have a much higher capacity for empathy than basically anyone I know, but we often talk about sense of morality. She has a very strong moral compass and sense of justice. I don’t think it’s so much that NT people lack this sense of justice/morality (obviously there are exceptions but I don’t consider psychopaths that lack morals as NT), so much as it’s much easier for them to ignore to not upset the status quo. This comes out mainly at work. She would burn bridges because she would see major moral issues come up that her coworkers just kind of ignored but it ate at her until she finally said something, often being dismissed as a result unfortunately. It’s a really interesting topic though
@CaptFeather @zarmanto I think autistics might tend to view moral issues deontological rather than utilitaristic. Would match recent science which says autistic‘s prediction models play less of a role in their perception than their senses. NT on the other hand perceive things more in light of prior experiences and thus utilitaristic.
I absolutely agree. She’s a vet tech and since animals being mistreated by her coworkers don’t have a voice she feels it’s her responsibility to speak up for them. I admire her for that, even though it tends to limited the hospitals she can work at.
Very eye opening how many people are in medicine (human and animal) that lack compassion. She told me about an elderly doctor she briefly worked for that was treating a dog who had a fox tail stuck in its law for son long that it ended up coming out the other side. Poor pup had a hole in its paw. Anyway this doc had to make sure there was no debris in the wound so he stuck his finger in the hole without anesthesia. She walked out of the room after yelling at him and quit shortly after. Anyway, my point is her NT coworkers all kinda just stood around and watched and clearly weren’t as bothered by this as she was.
I actually hate the term neurodivergent or neurodiverse, it’s so tentative and annoying. I’ve been called crazy my entire life, they might as well just stick with that - it’s clearly what they’re implying.
@feedum_sneedson @zarmanto In German „crazy“ is translated as „verrückt“. The literal meaning is „disarranged“ or „shifted“ - so just a deviation from the norm. Sounds not to bad to me, I like being called „verrückt“.
I always think of probability distributions in this context. Taking something like the bell curve for instance. Being bang-on precisely average is actually very unlikely. Some degree of “divergence” or “variation” from the mean is in fact the far more likely state. Even taking the typical +/- 1 standard deviation, which comprises ~68% … that leaves ~32% that do not fall into the middle or normal range.
That’s a huge amount of people that may all be very different from each other, even more different from each other than they are from “the average”, but are all very different from “normal”. IMO, it’s not appreciated enough how much variation is baked into anything statistical.
I think “highly developed morals” refers to, for example, internally consistent morals. Calling them highly developed shouldn’t be understood to imply the morals are “better” or more “right”, only that they are consistent. My neurotypical family members have morals and they will preach those morals to literal death. When actual circumstances of life require a sacrifice of them to live within the morals they preach though, they have no difficulty imagining a special exception to those morals.
My 6yo was watching Avatar 2 for the first time and the scene where the humans are burning down the forests, and he immediately asks me “how can there so much fire if people have to wear masks to breathe?”
Last year we saw a pickup merging on the highway with a balloon arch in the back and he immediately realized what was about to happen.
He’s very empathetic (he is vegetarian and can’t fathom eating meat. He literally cries over the meat section of a supermarket, though he’s a bit dramatic). And he’s always asking me about complex things like black holes and gravity and inertia and tectonics.
Is he…gifted? How do we find out?
In Ontario, Canada, if they still do it the same way as they did in the 80s/90s, they do a test in grade 3 which can determine giftedness. After the test I was sent to do a psycho-educational assessment, then sent off to another school with a gifted program. I was in gifted classes until the end of grade 10. I definitely made some great friends in that program, but I think I would have been better off being taught how to survive in the real world, compared to the experience of having your own special class. There is no “special class” in the workplace. Or, you can probably just go directly to a psychologist for a psycho-educational assessment, but there is usually a cost involved.
If you made friends, it taught you social skills.
The problem with gifted students is that they can struggle connecting with those who don’t enjoy abstract thinking, theory, etc, but at the same time it was one period of your school day, you had all the others including recess and lunch to learn that.
Not talking about social skills, and when I went to school, gifted classes were full time, from grades 4-8.
Posted this a couple weeks ago in /AuDHD. I was wondering how long it would take to circulate and be reposted here. 😄
We already had adhd and autism so obviously !rickandmorty and !archlinux are next for the gifted people.
