Strange New Worlds has been my favorite Trek since Next Generation, and if the quality continues, could easily be my favorite Trek ever. But with the e.p. wishing for more episodes per season, there’s a danger of diluting the show by adding weak episodes that would have never made it in a 10 episode season.

One of the things I’ve long admired with BBC shows is their normally low-episode seasons, which kept out a lot of filler that normally made it in to the broadcast shows from the states. But streaming (and before that, cable) changed things. Finally US based shows were able to create much lower episode seasons, allowing the creators to tell more of the story they wanted to tell, without stretching things out (too much), or being forced to add stories they weren’t thrilled with in order to fill the season. (Though, even with shorter runs, shows are still doing this. Picard season 2, for example, could have used some trimming. So, yeah, show runners are still being forced to fill seasons where X number of episodes were ordered before the story was fleshed out. Maybe it just seems more evident in serialized shows.)

I can’t help but think a longer season of SNW would be a “more is less” scenario. I’d much rather see Paramount create another Trek show that’s mainly episodic, that’s been shown the same attention to quality that SNW has received.

66 points

Alternatively, some of the best episodes of TNG were “bottle” episodes to fill space and keep costs down. If 90s trek had shorter seasons would we have had “Measure of a Man” ,“Duet”, or “Masks” made?

I know the days of a 24 episode season are long gone due to the increase of production time in modern TV, but maybe we could have 13 to 15 episodes ? Enough for a 10 episode dedicated season arc with a few others just to explore some weird anomalies that make no sense at all.

permalink
report
reply
4 points

I said pretty much the same in a comment above, but I’m not against filler, or bottle episodes, though I may have come off that way. I’m just against bad filler, stuff that would have never made it into a show if there was no predetermined season lengths. In a perfect world, it would be great if stories could be chosen simply because they were great stories. I’d like to know that something like the Fly episode of Breaking Bad would could still be filmed just because the show runners thought it was a great story, and not because they had a make a certain number of episodes and needed to save some money on one episode so they could spend more on another.

permalink
report
parent
reply
6 points

Honestly, I think there should be some really corny/goofy “what were they thinking” clunker episodes. Not lazy writing that disregards established character traits or contradicts itself or anything, but something they try that doesn’t work, but they tried in earnest and it shows.

Something that reminds you of the participatory nature of suspension of disbelief.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Not sure I’d put Masks alongside Measure of Man or Duet. Or indeed have it as an argument for filler episodes.

Given TNG never had much character serialisation, I’d say filler is more like those DS9 and ENT episodes late on that never fit I to anybody’s arc. Like the holosuite ones. Some amazing ones from DS9. Some less so from Enterprise.

But SNW has a good balance between episodic and serialisation. All this comes down to can they keep up the quality on greater volume. That needs more investment at a time when Paramount is cutting back…

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

Masks is my favorite Data TNG episode.

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points

Yeah Spiner’s acting in that episode is great, it’s a bit ridiculous and over the point but I believe that that was intentional, and I am not holding it against the episode

permalink
report
parent
reply
51 points
*

Longer seasons would allow them to throw in a few SciFi oriented episodes that don’t necessarily advance character arcs. Where would SNW be if TOS didn’t have the “Arena” (Gorn) episode that was based on a completely unrelated SciFi short story?

Mirror, Mirror was a SciFi episode that not only gave us the foundation for Discovery, but cemented the evil-twin-goatee trope into pupular culture.

Space Seed (Botany Bay/Khan) was also a one-off SciFi episode. Where would the entire franchise be without it?

I really hope SNW makes room for exploring the sort of SciFi ideas that Star Trek was originally based on.

permalink
report
reply
16 points

SNW has been pretty good with the standalone episodes though, no? Maybe leaning a little more on the comedy and hijinks than the sci-fi this season but they don’t seem too afraid of treating an episode as a mini movie in its own right.

I wouldn’t mind a few more episodes anyway, but 20 does feel like too much. And honestly I’m not unhappy with 10 either, particularly considering the quality of them and that it’s not the only Trek in town. 10 episodes of this show, but there’s like three or four other shows too. We’re not at a loss for Trek.

permalink
report
parent
reply
14 points
*

Part of the reason why TNG was good beyond the first couple seasons was because of the open script submission policy that’s no longer in existence. According to ex-Trek producer Ronald D. Moore, they were reading something like 3000 scripts a year. It allowed them to be choosy (though there were still some stinkers). Now that the characters are established, if the seasons were longer, it might be cool to see the open script submissions come back (though, as I’m typing this, maybe implementing this during or shortly after a writers strike would be a poor choice, even though there were limits to how many scripts one could submit before going through “official” channels). Anyway, one could argue that a huge amount of ideas need to be generated for a show as great as TNG to exist, more than a small group of writers could produce. If outside script admissions were allowed, I’m sure we’d see some great sci-fi episodes from writers who weren’t even thinking “Star Trek” as they wrote them.

I’m not against filler, and my post may have come off as being that way. Not every story has to advance character or advance some storyline. I’m just against bad filler.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points

Just a fun note: Ron Moore got his start through that open submissions policy when submitted a script for what became “The Bonding.” He had no writing credits before that.

permalink
report
parent
reply
7 points

Several of the Relaunch novelverse TrekLit authors tried out with spec scripts before being picked up to write tie-in fiction.

David Mack, a film school grad, got script credits for 2 DS9 episodes, Starship Down and Only a Paper Moon before being contracted for some Starfleet Core of Engineers stories.

Kirsten Beyer, a theatre grad, never got into one of the shows with a spec script, but was picked up to write Voyager books, then came full circle to be in the writers rooms on all the new live-action shows.

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

Man, if they opened up script submissions, they’d probably be able to reap a LOT of fanfic-grown talent out there. Yeah, the slush pile would SUCK because it’s much easier to submit online than in the days of snail mail and paper, but we’ve had about 20 years of really explosive writing growth with the advent of fanfic online and as far as I know nobody’s really “mentoring” those people in this day and age.

I know people laugh and snort at fanfic, but writing is writing is writing . You’d do as well to laugh at painters who sketch bowls of fruit or sketch nudes from live subjects (as if people haven’t drawn those things for literal centuries!). It doesn’t really matter WHERE you practice and learn so long as you do it, and if fanfic/fanart/whatever gets you going, that’s how you’re going to grow your talent, by practicing over and over.

And some people get really damn good at it. If Trek opened up script submissions again, it’d open the doors to a new generation of writers kicking their careers off.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

I couldn’t agree more. With Star Trek, or any established properties where the originator isn’t in control (Marvel, Star Wars, etc.), it’s all pretty much fanfic, professional or not. The writers are playing in a world they haven’t created.

permalink
report
parent
reply
2 points

A new challenge with open submissions would be low effort AI spam. Scifi magazines are buckling under the tidal wave of crud right now https://www.theverge.com/2023/2/25/23613752/ai-generated-short-stories-literary-magazines-clarkesworld-science-fiction

permalink
report
parent
reply
26 points

I’ve been rewatching TNG and it has become very, very apparent to me how much of the charm of the show was due to two things:

  1. The sheer chemistry of the cast. Since really learning how much they all loved each other, it really just feels like a ship of joy.

  2. The filler episodes let you spend time with the cast. I mean, you rarely get something like a whole scene about Data painting, or stroking a fake beard, or Geordi striking out with multiple women, or Troi extolling the virtues of chocolate sundaes.

I’ve been really impressed by how much SNW has been able to do with the ensemble, it really feels like the cast have relationships, so if we can get more of that, yes please!

I almost want to believe that they’re cancelling Discovery to give more resources to SNW’s production schedule. ;)

permalink
report
reply
6 points
*
Deleted by creator
permalink
report
parent
reply
22 points

20 seems unrealistic given the longer shooting time per episode and actors’ wanting flexibility to be able to work on more than one project.

12-15 however seems very possible especially with the episodic format. Producing a longer season after the strike especially would seem wise. It would also allow Paramount to take a brief hiatus midseason (the way Discovery did originally) to stretch out the schedule.

SNW has already demonstrated that it is an ensemble show with a full cast that can basically carry or star in their own episodes. Not every main cast member needs to be on set every production day, and even the principal character, Pike, can step back in some episodes.

permalink
report
reply
18 points

Hey, with more episodes we might have gotten a proper Ortegas episode…

permalink
report
reply
13 points
*

It’s likely the impact of the sudden and unexpected death of Melissa Navia’s husband led to a lightning of her role in the second season.

She’s written about how hard it was for her to go into production just a couple of months after that. She was a musical theatre performer as a child, so it’s likely that a larger singing role was planned for her in 2 x 09. We can be thankful that she has apparently decided to stick with her career after some profound doubts in 2022.

permalink
report
parent
reply
5 points

I hope Melissa continues to find the fandom to be a source of surrogate family. It was nice to see the fandom’s outpouring of empathy and support after her tragic loss. It’s not the same, but since it seems to have given her some comfort, I hope that dynamic can be something special for her for a long time.

permalink
report
parent
reply
1 point

Oh damn. I had no idea.

permalink
report
parent
reply
4 points

:(

permalink
report
parent
reply
3 points

But we had her episode. We know her name is Erica Ortegas and that she flies the ship. What else do we need?

permalink
report
parent
reply

Star Trek

!startrek@startrek.website

Create post

r/startrek: The Next Generation

Star Trek news and discussion. No slash fic…

Maybe a little slash fic.


New to Star Trek and wondering where to start?


Rules

1 Be constructive

All posts/comments must be thoughtful and balanced.


2 Be welcoming

It is important that everyone from newbies to OG Trekkers feel welcome, no matter their gender, sexual orientation, religion or race.


3 Be truthful

All posts/comments must be factually accurate and verifiable. We are not a place for gossip, rumors, or manipulative or misleading content.


4 Be nice

If a polite way cannot be found to phrase what it is you want to say, don’t say anything at all. Insulting or disparaging remarks about any human being are expressly not allowed.


5 Spoilers

Utilize the spoiler system for any and all spoilers relating to the most recently-aired episodes, as well as previews for upcoming episodes. There is no formal spoiler protection for episodes/films after they have been available for approximately one week.


6 Keep on-topic

All submissions must be directly about the Star Trek franchise (the shows, movies, books etc.). Off-topic discussions are welcome at c/quarks.


7 Meta

Questions and concerns about moderator actions should be brought forward via DM.


Upcoming Episodes

Date Episode Title
11-21 LD 5x06 “Of Gods and Angles”
11-28 LD 5x07 “Fully Dilated”
12-05 LD 5x08 “Upper Decks”
12-12 LD 5x09 “Fissue Quest”
12-19 LD 5x10 “The New Next Generation”

Episode Discussion Archive


In Production

Strange New Worlds (2025)

Section 31 (2025-01-24)

Starfleet Academy (TBA)

In Development

Untitled comedy series


Wondering where to stream a series? Check here.


Allied Discord Server


Community stats

  • 1K

    Monthly active users

  • 1.3K

    Posts

  • 12K

    Comments