cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/13118199
(Title shamelessly stolen from this comment in the crossposted !micromobility thread.)
The problem isn’t the class of the electric bike.
Riding on the sidewalk is extremely dangerous. Drivers will often turn (without signalling even) and not notice a bicycle coming up from behind them on a sidewalk. Driver also often back out of driveways without being able to see a bike approaching on a sidewalk.
Cyclists should be taught how to ride safely on the road and use all of the proper safety equipment.
I’ve commuted by bike for years and frequently shake my head when I see the behavior of other cyclists.
People ride on the sidewalks for a simple reason: the roads do not feel safe enough for riding for them, because there are car drivers there behaving in a manner lethal to non-car drivers (and other drivers too fwiw).
All solutions begin with taking the lethal actor out of the equation. Anything else is needless victim blaming and can be dismissed without any more discussion.
I don’t disagree that roads can feel unsafe. But there’s an important detail about sidewalk riding: you can be traveling against the direction of traffic. This is demonstrably dangerous at any kind of lot entry or any time cars can traverse the sidewalk path, because there should not be vehicle traffic moving in a different direction.
So I’d say both parts are true. Bikers may feel unsafe and may be unsafe on congested roads (or especially roads without dedicated bike paths), but riding on sidewalks is actually demonstrably unsafe for the biker (not to mention unsafe for anyone walking on the sidewalk).
This is demonstrably dangerous at any kind of lot entry or any time cars can traverse the sidewalk path, because there should not be vehicle traffic moving in a different direction.
It depends on the sidewalks. They should be on a different grade, and separated from the road by some distance. Although part of the problem is that SUVs jump kerbs more easily, and this type of “car” has become dominant in recent years.
Cyclists should have safe infrastructure instead of riding with vehicle traffic. Don’t try to shift the responsibility.
I’m saying that as an experienced cyclist as well.
Cyclists are more likely to die on the sidewalk than sharing the road. Given the choice, use the road 99% of the time.
I dunno, the sidewalk on the six lane stroad near me seems much safer than the fast, congested road with lane-hopping cars and low visibility.
I get it, and I use sidewalks sparingly, but it really is circumstantial (it’s legal to ride a footpath where I live). For example, slow riding a footpath is much safer than fast riding a footpath because you have more time to react to cars entering/exiting driveways. If you’re riding somewhere nearby that’s actually quite a nice experience. But if you are trying to get somewhere more than a kilometre away, slow footpath riding would obviously slow you down a lot.
I think we really should enforce backing into spaces. As you apoproach the spot/driveway you can confirm it is clear then safely back in. When you go to leave again you have better visbility than if you pulled in and have to back out.
Anyone who says they arent comfortable enough backing into a space shouldn’t be driving.
It’s so easy to back into spaces now with rear view cameras as standard. Always surprises me that more people don’t do it
I hear so many people say people are dumb for backing into spaces, it makes me want to back into spaces more 😈
No. Just no.
What cyclists need is dedicated infrastructure. Take it away from the car infrastructure, there is so so so so so too much car infrastructure already, convert it into much cheaper cycle infrastructure instead. Add more Public transportation infrastructure while we’re at it. THAT will make it safer, not just blaming cyclists anyway
Take an example from the Netherlands.
I started riding on the road and was promptly rewarded with a nail in my tire. I’ll stick to my area’s multi use path.
Though admittedly if the speed limit and design limit are is 35mph or less I don’t mind the road since I’m on an ebike.
I see so many inexperienced or uneducated cyclists in my city, I almost want to make some sort of “safe cycling” video tutorial. Stuff like not riding on sidewalks (especially on stroads), Idaho stops, how to navigate intersections safely, when to take the lane, how to find routes that are safer for cycling rather than just using the route you’d take in a car, etc.
I actually feel safer on my bike than as a pedestrian in my city, but people don’t know the basics of safe cycling and get frightened by all the close calls they get when/if they try cycling. They then proceed to never cycle again because it’s “dangerous”, when really most of the danger can be avoided with smart, conscious riding.
I think that anyone who bicycles around motor vehicles is going to have a frightening moment or close call at some point. Riding on roads where one feels most comfortable will hopefully help keep them riding, and when they feel comfortable and experienced enough, move to more “active” roads.
There’s a road where I live that’s 25mph speed limit, very busy with cars, pedestrians, shops, intersections, crosswalks, and lots of people looking for on street parking. I’ve been cycling for years and that road still requires ALL of my attention and lightning reflexes to navigate safely.
I’ve been cycling on the road for a good 25+ years at this point… and sorry but, you’re full of shit. No matter what I do to “cycle safely”, I still get close passed, cut off, left hooked, raged at for taking the lane (as is safe to do so)… The issue isn’t my cycling, its the cars and the idiots driving them.
Yep, was at a 4 way stop the other day, let 2 cars go through the intersection, go myself and nearly get run over and the driver tried to tell me to wait my turn. Old fuck never even looked. I’m 6’0" on a fat tire ebike wearing a safety jacket and was standing the entire time
I guess I didn’t express myself properly, because I did not in any way want to suggest that safe cycling practices would necessarily protect you from the hoards of ignorant and inattentive drivers on the roads. IMO the best advice for cycling is ride as if everyone in a car is actively trying to hurt you.
That being said, I do see a lot of cyclists in my city do stuff which puts them in risky situations more often than they need to be, which is what I was trying (and apparently failed, judging from the downvotes) to get at. No amount of safe cycling practices will make up for improper infrastructure or lack of proper driver training, that much I’m sure we agree on.But I’d hope you’ll agree that one’s not putting the odds in their favour if they’re, for example, riding down the wrong side of the road on the sidewalk at night without lights. If you’ve been cycling for 25+ years, I’ve no doubt you already follow most if not all of the safe cycling practices I wish I could share with my fellow cyclists, the intent of my comment was not to victim-blame cyclists but rather expressing my wish to help educate noobie cyclists to reach the level of knowledge and comfort on the road that more experienced cyclists like us take for granted.
Of course you’ll still face road conflicts no matter what, the majority of drivers are a menace to public safety. It’s not a matter of eliminating risk, it’s about minimizing points of potential conflict in order to minimize risk.
If you’ve been doing it this long you know that you’re the outlier. Bicyclists are terrifying to be near.
The fact that I’ve seen so few cyclists wearing high visibility gear is astounding. That was the first thing I bought after buying my bike, was a high-vis retro-reflective vest. Probably also helps that my bike has running lights, but still.
People shouldnt need to be neon colored to not be killed on their commute.
I’m not following your line of thinking.
If we banished all cars, and people where on dedicated E-Bike/Bike roads, you assume dangerous collisions at night would just disappear?
I consider lights to be a necessity. I have a bright 1800 lumen Niterider headlight that I love and (I think) a 350 lumen Cygolite taillight. I never ride on the road without at least the taillight flashing.
My state law considers them to be a necessity as well (at night). Sadly about half the bicycle riders I see riding at night have no lights. Occasionally I see them in a local news article once they get struck by a car.
Go for ankle straps over vests. It’s far more important for the reflective materials to be moving than the amount of body coverage you have.
GCN recently covered this topic with interviews of optometry and psychology professors: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33GpfTWdk8U
Absolutely baffling that you’re being downvoted. Anyone using the road needs plenty of ways that other road-users can see them easily. Cars and motorcycles have lights and reflectors, bicycles need them too!
You’re ignoring that the cyclist is being blamed instead of any other thing. Say like the terrible infrastructure for starters.
When does an E-Bike become a motorcycle that someone is just riding down a sidewalk?
God forbid they formulate some laws/rules that would allow people to safely use something other than a car.
Most larger cities already have this kind of law in place anyway, limiting the power of the motors on e-bikes. For instance, mine is a Class-2 with a max speed of around 14mph and motor rated at 500w. It’s actually got a 1000w motor in it so it’s up to that speed really quickly, but it struggles to go faster because the bike is 70lbs with a 300lb rider (I bought it to lose weight and commute to work).
Makes perfect sense in my eyes to limit the speeds like this. Bike lanes are usually shit anyway, with crap all over ‘em from the road. No point in having an accident because some idiot had a blowout and nobody cleaned up the tire.
14mph? That’s like 20km/h. What’s the point unless you live somewhere really hilly?
It’s faster than walking, I don’t have to buy gas, it’s far cheaper to maintain, and it’s getting me active again.
Insanity. It’s not like this kid going too fast was even the issue, nothing about what they’re proposing would have avoided the incident.
He was one month shy of his 16th birthday when he died. Now he’d have to wait a month or get his learner’s permit before being allowed to get killed by a car on an e-bike.
How can anyone be so stupid?
I do cycle quite often (on stiff roads here, man…) and this reads to me like favoritism.
