122 points

I’m honestly surprised they’re still updating Java edition

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113 points
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That’s the version people actually play, and which has the furthest developed systems to do bigger stuff. Look up PaperMC, it enables some wild stuff for Minecraft multiplayer.

The server options available for multiplayer in Bedrock are truly pathetic in comparison.

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56 points
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I know. I’ve seen a lot of videos on the differences between Java and Bedrock, how Bedrock came to be, modding on Java like Feed The Beast, and multiplayer servers like 2BT2 (for those that don’t know FitMC has some good vidoes on 2B2T; it’s a neat rabbit hole to go down if you want to kill sometime).

What I am saying is I am surprised that Microsoft is still updating Java when there’s so much money to be made nickle and diming players in Bedrock edition. Like paying for skins for example. It would definitely piss off a lot of the player base but I don’t know if it would cause them to lose money in the long run. I imagine a lot of casual players are content using Bedrock and unaware of why Java is important.

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48 points

Minecraft is already on the way out of the Zeitgeist of cultural relevance. The minecraft audience is mostly nostalgic grown ups now. Bedrock is kept alive by parents trying to have quality time with their kids on a safer or easier to maintain server space. The truly passionate and obsessed users, doing crazy and innovative stuff to their servers are still on Java edition. Kill Java and you kill Minecraft for all practical intents and purposes.

Kids are playing roblox now anyways.

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25 points

Kids are all playing Bedrock on their Switches and iPads. Microsoft is just passing the long game.

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17 points

Java is quite popular online due to all the mods and the videos people upload to YouTube using those mods, but I believe in terms of number of users, Bedrock outscores it quite a bit. The barrier to entry is lower – $7 on iOS/Android and most people have phones.

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0 points
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actually bedrock servers are way more capable, bedrock has proper reconnect packets, custom ui frameworks (i.e. servers can do proper themed guis that look fucking awesome instead of relying on chests) and custom 3d models.

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2 points

which they sell to you through microtransactions

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2 points
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People already pirate Java to shit, if they made it unavailable than that immediately legitimizes all of it under the game preservation argument.

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1 point

Does FFA stand for free for all?

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2 points

I used better language this time

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1 point

Any argument in favour of respecting the minecraft copyright went out the window wheb The Hated One sold out the playerbase to microsoft for two billions.

Yeah, open source it you FUCK !

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81 points

Genuine question: why does bedrock exist? What does it bring? Why is there the choice between java, bedrock and “Minecraft for windows”?

How do you fuck up this badly?

I tried using the launcher to move a java install from C: to another drive and it just points there and doesn’t do anything? Steam had this stuff figured years ago

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146 points

Minecraft rewritten for better performance with platform interoperability in mind and so on. Essentially what could’ve or should’ve been a replacement to Minecraft if done right. It was not done right. Quite the opposite.

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10 points

In what world is c++ better for cross platform than Java?

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55 points

In a world with consoles. Java needs a JVM, and those aren’t typical with things like the Switch (2 soon), PS5, and Xbox Series (half the alphabet).

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9 points

Good thing we have Minetest and Vintage Story!

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59 points

Because Bedrock runs on phones, tablets, consoles, and a host of other random crap, and does so relatively well. Because of that the install base and playtime especially among younger players is actually massively skewed toward Bedrock being the more used. Add to that rumors that the Java codebase at least was a terrible mess, and the performance issues Java edition still has to this day and it’s no wonder they wanted to do a full rewrite, especially after having to make things like the console editions and even one for the 3DS.

The windows launcher is annoying though.

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44 points

Because Bedrock runs on phones, tablets, consoles, and a host of other random crap

And it also removes Linux support. Typical Microsoft.

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19 points

To be fair there’s a Linux version of the bedrock server. But yeah not having it on the steam deck is pretty annoying.

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12 points

Linux and mac and any other x86 compatible platform that runs java…

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15 points
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There’s also the fact that Bedrock patches bugs that the Java community freaks out about patching. Several chunk update glitches and undesirable redstone behavior are exploited by the Java players, and they go nuts over the idea of fixing the issues. Bedrock, being a new codebase, obviously didn’t port over old crusty bugs and therefore doesn’t have to carry over those expectations.

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20 points

To be fair I’d call it a wash. Bedrock fixes a lot of weird stuff like quasi connectivity and being able to push things like chests with pistons but also introduces it’s own bugs like weird timing things and randomly taking fall damage. There’s also weird differences like being able to do things with cauldrons or just like minor texture differences that they are slowly bringing into sync.

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12 points
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Also swapped performance issues with more bugs that were there years ago and still persist because they are almost impossible to fix.

In the end, we all know it was done either because they wanted to shove microtransactions down our throat and/or had some kind of deal to maintain the Java edition without microtransactions.

Or, maybe, just maybe, they though “it’s just a block game, what could be so hard to rewrite it?” and absolutely failed what a single person got right almost immediately back in the day (like not falling through the floor all the time).

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4 points

rumors

You can remove that word, rly.

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17 points

Java is a hilariously bad platform for games.

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6 points

Only if you’re incompetent. Otherwise just not optimal.

Starsector, Rise to Ruins and Project Zomboid run well and are made in Java for example. It’s harder to pull off but it can be done. (still needs native libraries though)

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2 points

No it isn’t

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5 points

What makes you say that? I’m genuinely curious

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5 points

Honestly? Most large companies are more like high school. It’s all, friend groups, people rubbing each other’s backs, and in-fighting between departments.

A lot of VERY LARGE decisions get made for the stupidest reason.

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3 points
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Minecraft for windows is the old name for bedrock.
it was based on the same MCPE codebase

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3 points

Is there even a choice? You now get both games when you buy one(and you get the other game for free if you already own one) and you can play on bedrock on java servers with geysermc

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3 points

I accidentally bought Minecraft for windows for someone when I wanted java… so that was fun.

The launcher just says “here are the options” it doesn’t say why you might want to choose one over another. Ive played since day 0 so I’ve always gone with java.

Just felt like if bedrock was meant to replace java they should have just done it and dealt with it instead of having so many choices.

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59 points

They saw an opportunity to charge for mods on consoles.

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2 points

Famously always goes over well.

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46 points

Java > Bedrock

F*ck M$ for even making Bedrock…
It’s an inferior version of Minecraft and it fractures the modding community.

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75 points

its technically better.

microsoft just made it limited and stupid on purpose to make more money off it. which is more infuriating imo.

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16 points

Yea, back in the day I dreamt about a Minecraft that didn’t run on Java and thus better on the low end hardware I had. In my dreams it just still had all the benefits of the Java edition which is why I now dream of old Java Minecraft

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3 points

Yeah the infuriating part is not the mere existence of bedrock, but the fact that they purposefully made it suck. It could have been much better than the java version if they did it right.

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3 points

Also very on the nose for Microsoft

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11 points

So just fuck everyone who doesn’t play on Pc? There are aspects about bedrock that should be gotten rid of, but it’s existence is for the ability for cross play to exist. I play both versions but bedrock made making a cross platform server for my friends and I (who all play on different consoles) possible.

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2 points

Instead of making bedrock edition,
they could have focused on supporting JVM, and thus Minecraft Java Edition, for more consoles.

But since Java is a C# (also from M$) competitor, they likely did not want to go that route.

Anyways, you can play Java Edition on Linux, Mac, Windows and also Android.

Multiple consoles (E.g. PS4 / Nintendo Switch) unofficially support dual booting to Linux and/or Android.

For Android you can use PojavLauncher,
it even supports modpacks:
https://github.com/PojavLauncherTeam/PojavLauncher

I will not touch Bedrock edition,
especially not since it requires you to sign in on your Windows with a M$ account, while my Windows KVM is Ameliorated, which strips the ability to do so, nor would I want to if I could.

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3 points

Yeah I hate the signing into a Microsoft account part. It’s unnecessary and they need to get over no one uses Hotmail.

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1 point
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you don’t need to sign in, you can just sideload the appx package (it’s likely to fail due to license verification, there are ways around it tho, like stopping the licensing service)

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41 points

Java has had mod support for like 7 years now.

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11 points
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Does it have official support though?

Edit: To be clear this comment was referencing what OP’s post was likely trying to convey. Of course Minecraft has been moddable on Java for years but as the Minecraft help page says it isn’t officially supported. I know about data packs and their support/limitations.

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33 points

Yes. They’re called datapacks.

“Oh! Those aren’t mods!”

Well, they modify the game, so they’re mods.

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11 points
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Yeah what I was asking about is official support in Java; that’s probably what OP is referencing. I looked it up and the answer is no.

It’s a bit like saying Skyrim didn’t have mod support in 2011 when it released until 2017 when Creation Club content was added. Of course there were mods in 2011 but not officially supported ones.

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8 points

Also texture/resource packs are also technically mods, because you are modifying the game’s resources and packs are officially supported.

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13 points

“Mod Support” means (or at least, it used to) the game has structures in place to allow modifications, not that the company is paywalling mods that they “approve”. I’m not sure what the latter is called, but I’m quite sure there’d be a massive uproar if MS/MJ did that for java edition. I know I’d never play the game again, that’s for sure.

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1 point
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I never thought adding a paywall was necessary. I was more thinking along the lines of a game being made easier to mod and its developers embracing the idea of modding like you kind of mentioned. This could be done by releasing tools to make it easier like Cities: Skylines 2’s recently released editor and Hatred adding Workshop support. I don’t know if official mod support Java would entail something like a built in mod manager, updates to improve modding capabilities, or some kind of universal package for mod files.

This doesn’t need to be done through a service that the developer has any control over. SimCity 2000 had a Build Architect Tool players could use in the mid 90s and sites like ModDB and the Nexus exist.

I’m not sure what the latter is called, but I’m quite sure there’d be a massive uproar if MS/MJ did that for java edition. I know I’d never play the game again, that’s for sure.

There will always be the option of raw dogging files into the game directory or developing external tools like people did with Mass Effect.

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3 points

They did release official mappings

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0 points

Kiiind of? Data packs come pretty close and don’t have the massive security issue of just allowing people to execute random jars at root.

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