Yeah, sure. But since she already threw up, she’s drunk enough to make it problematic.

It also depends on what is being consented to. We accept that drunk people can consent to commit crimes, but that they cannot consent to have sex.

You’re wrong, drunk drivers never get fined when they run over someone.

/s

I already replied to your similar comment on my thread, but I’m going to repeat myself here to give this maximum visibility; vomiting does not remove alcohol from your system. You become intoxicated not when you swallow alcohol, but when the alcohol in your stomach is metabolized and enters your blood stream. If you are vomiting from alcohol, it means your body has metabolized so much alcohol that it has recognized that it is being poisoned. It is purging your stomach to prevent you from metabolizing any more poison, but it is not removing any alcohol from your system (AKA your bloodstream). Someone is just as drunk just before they threw as they were after they threw up. That person will only become sober once their liver has had time to filter the alcohol out of their system.

Since OP is not throwing up, but the girl in his story is, it is far, far more likely that she is much drunker than him. Unless he had other symptoms of alcohol poisoning (and it seems like he would have mentioned that), it is safe to assume that her BAC is much higher than his. More broadly, you should never think that someone vomiting up alcohol is a sign that they are sobering up.

We can pretty safely assume OP is also drunk

How? Pre-gaming doesn’t typically result in being drunk, it’s something you do to cut the costs of getting drunk at a bar. It’s usually something like 1-2 drinks, so you’d be a little buzzed, but not drunk. If he was drunk, I highly doubt he’d have the fortitude to refuse, because alcohol dramatically lowers your inhibitions. It could also be that OP doesn’t drink, he just went because he likes the girl.

So no, I don’t think we can safely assume OP is drunk. Also, you don’t throw up alcohol until after you’re already drunk, so throwing up most of the alcohol isn’t going to sober her up.

No, that is not what I argued. I said that if she used force or coercion, she would have raped him.

Coercion is the use of social, emotional, or other non physical means to cause a person to act against their will.

Rape is not always an act of physical force. You didn’t say that it was, I’m just repeating it for general purpose.

The night ending in sex would have meant that she sobered up, expressed her consent and intent, then he agreed to sex.

It is kinda possible for two people to rape each other, but there’s a shit-ton of stretching of the term, plus very unlikely situations to make it so. Even then, there would be a ton of argument about it from anyone not involved.

I think you either misunderstood, I phrased things badly, or my dyslexia + poor proofreading via tts screwed something up. I can’t find any errors, so I have to assume the first two.

There are a ton of ways to use non physical force on someone, and most of them can not only be done while drunk, but the inhibition being depressed via alcohol could make someone more likely to use them.

That is not the same thing as attempting to convince someone to have sex with you by using your physical appearance, the offer of sex (or specific sex acts), or even just by being an asshole and not leaving them alone. As shitty as nagging at someone for sex is, it hasn’t the same thing as rape, so long as the person being the target is capable of consent and has freedom to leave.

but this specific case, I don’t know it was possible for her to be the raper.

In my mind, even if you lack the means to commit a crime, you still wanted to commit that crime and you tried to commit that crime.

To find out who raped who we need an immediate BAC test of both parties, the one who is higher is the victim, the less drunk one goes to prison. We’ll call it Rape Roulette and sell it to netflix for millions.

Quoting so it’s easier to see for me as I write.

i do way too much street fent, nearly die, and wake up in an alley somewhere, am i responsible for what happened to me in between those points? Or not? It’s not like i stopped existing as a person. Physically, i am fully responsible for what happened in that state, psychologically, i am to some degree at the very least tangentially responsible. (there is a reason why you cant drink and drive)

In terms of consent based events, no. If someone else takes advantage of your state, even the voluntary intake of substances doesn’t remove the obligation to obtain meaningful consent from the inebriated person by any other party.

It also depends on the substance. Some stuff, you have way less ability to function consciously. Others, you’re changed so little as to be kinda irrelevant outside of determining the exact consequences in a complicated situation. As an example, if someone slams too much caffeine and punches somebody, that’s 100% on them in any normal circumstances. Something like weed, you run into edge cases where it might be a mitigation, but not as much since there’s less inhibition of the conscious mind compared to something like fentanyl. A pothead robs a store with their buddy, I’m not going to believe they couldn’t have refused because of the weed (under normal circumstances). If they’re barely functional from opiates, I might buy that they didn’t really know what was going on, and got swept up in things.

That last one is a real thing I’ve run across a few times. Dudes thieving while high and claiming to only have been dragged along, and then having something shoved in their hands and be told to run. It’s believable with some drugs, less so with others.

Like anything about human behavior and social rules, the more specific things get, the easier it is to throw down a definite yes/no regarding culpability. The more general it stays, the more you have to deal in a degree of “usually, but”.

That is separate (in my opinion as well as in law in some places) from the inebriated person committing bad or illegal acts themselves.

There’s also a middle ground where a person that’s inebriated may have some degree of exculpatory claim if someone used their altered state to get them to commit a bad or illegal act. They’d still be responsible, but any judgements on their acts should take it into account (socially and legally).

Edit: also, I apologize for taking so long to respond, but I was having trouble reading for some reason, and I couldn’t use tts when I first got the notification. Dyslexia is fucking weird sometimes. I don’t usually have this much trouble lol.

Extremely drunk people are not in the state of mind to consent