With fighting raging around Khan Younis and in the north of Gaza, a video has emerged on social media showing dozens of Palestinian men detained by Israel.
And they still call themselves democratic country. Very democratic of them to humiliate human beings whose only fault is that they are of “military age” and not evacuated to the south. Apparently for Israel all males in Gaza are guilty until proven otherwise.
if you bother to think about it that’s highly unlikely.
When people say shit like this it makes me wonder how divorced from reality they are… do you really think it’s highly unlikely that the IDF did this after their other wonderful works:
- Filming themselves humiliating prisoners and others detained for no charge
- Repeatedly killing journalists then denying it. One example, and here is a report detailing the rest of those journalists, dead or detained.
- Killing 130 UN workers
- All these statements made by IDF soldiers about their systematic mistreatment, abuse, and torture of Palestinians, namely in Hebron
It is absolutely highly likely that the IDF has not stopped this.
I don’t even want to start with the stories of some of those Israel detained without a charge because it’s fucking tragic. One named Israa, her story is gut-wrenching and one in hundreds. This is what happened after her car broke down by a checkpoint:
She tried to open the windows, but they, too, were affected by the electrical failure. Again, she tried to exit the car, opening the door, but the officer rushed over and slammed it shut, crushing her hand. She yelled “Allahu Akbar ’alaiku” (God is greater than you are), chastising him several times for not allowing her to escape. She urged him to let her out as fire ignited in the front part of the car. He refused. He stood there, watching her burn inside. The airbag deployed, completely trapping her inside the blazing car.
The police officer who stopped her claimed that she was trying to use the propane tank to blow up the car. His testimony was the only one considered in the Israeli court, and Israa’ was branded a ‘terrorist’. She was sentenced to 11 years in prison. She is now serving her term at HaSharon prison inside Israel, and is denied much needed medical attention. After her debilitating injuries and imprisonment, her husband also suffered a car accident, leaving him permanently disabled and confined to a wheelchair. Their son, Mu’tasim, is now living with his grandmother in Jerusalem.
She was recently released. I’ll leave a picture of her face just so we don’t forget what kind of shit the IDF does
The example you have used appears to be a very unfortunate set of events. If you can put yourself in the soldiers place they were either worried about a car bomb attack (with the yells of god is great from a stopped car at a checkpoint it’s not that far fetched really) or they were psychopathic if how you are telling it is true. I don’t know the answer, they may well have been both. If it was an unfortunate set of events and the soldier was not psychopathic I could imagine they would probably feel at least some regret over the incident, I mean who wouldn’t? I don’t know
Ah yes, another apologist. I am sure if Israeli men were stripped and publicly humiliated like this, you would have been the first person to condemn it, but since it is just Palestinians who everyone knows are only Hamas supporters (/s) is just fine, right.
So perhaps you should think twice about who is “full of shit” here having double standards.
No I wouldn’t, this is what happens in a war zone. When the Americans were in the pacific they couldn’t trust the Japanese to surrender so they assumed they were dangerous, the ones that didn’t are probably dead. And also if I can recall, the last military operation from the Palestinian side the people weren’t really rounded up as much as slayed in their homes. The ones that were rounded up ended up being taken hostage. Hold on, I’m the one with double standards. Both sides have done shit I wouldn’t apologise for either side. There will never be peace as long as one side thinks and acts like they are completely innocent
Removed. You have it backwards:
“Even if only one of these people are combatants I would argue it’s justified for everyone’s safety”
In actuality it should be “Even if only one of these people are innocents I would argue it’s not justified for everyone’s human dignity.”
I understand what you’re saying but this is a different reality. The world you’re talking about needs a certain degree of civility to before it can be seen as reasonable. I know you won’t like this but being a soldier is usually an occupation. The job is to keep things secure. This is for both your own wellbeing and to complete the objective because everyone wants to finish the job and go home safely at the end of the day. Unfortunately sometimes it’s impossible to consider everyone’s feelings in every situation. I agree 100% that if you were a totally innocent person and you got rounded up and stripped it would be absolutely bullshit and unfair. I also think if you were a soldier following orders and you had half your face and arm blown off you would think that was unfair as well
Ah yes, stripping naked people and keeping them in the cold for hours and hours and then streaming this online is all because of the safety of Israel. How dare I question their sound judgement, right? So international laws don’t apply to Israel either, that’s my friend what I call double standards.
War? Don’t wars usually have sovereign nations on each side, fielding actual militaries and such. Looks more like an ethnic cleansing operation to me. By one sovereign nation on an ethnically defined and enforced internal enclave that isn’t even recognized to be a real place by half the world
The military on one side are a group of cowards hiding behind civilians and under their infrastructure. There are two sides here. The government of Gaza aka terrorist group Hamas vs Israel.
And they still call themselves democratic country. Very democratic of them to humiliate human beings whose only fault is that they are of “military age” and not evacuated to the south.
What exactly do you think democracy means and why does this run contrary to it? Democratic countries go to war all the time, especially when attacked. Perhaps this is about disarming and searching potential hostiles and not humiliation.
Apparently for Israel all males in Gaza are guilty until proven otherwise.
In the evacuation zone? Yes, and they have stated as such, everyone there will be considered a potential enemy combatant.
‘Evacuation zone’ aka these peoples homes and communities, where many other civilians need rescue and aid. No no please keep supporting the idea that 2 million people can just move to an undeveloped plain and have all aid including food, water and shelter withheld. Collective punishment is a war crime.
Monstrous take. Do better.
When nations go to war they go to war collectively, everyone who lives in said nations will have to all share the negative consequences of doing so. That is how war works. Counter-attacking a belligerent nation that attacked you and cutting off their supply lines is not collective punishment as in the war crime. That only applies when they are occupied, and Israel withdrew from Gaza and has not occupied it since 2005.
Inaccurate concern trolling, attempting to to bind Israel’s hands and deny them from achieving meaningful safety. Do better.
everyone there will be considered a potential enemy combatant.
Israel thinks its god, doesn’t it? Announces a military zone anywhere at all, then shoots people there right and left. What we have left is entire families wiped out, and 7k dead children, and a few thousands that are so traumatized and radicalized now that Israel has effectively set the stage for the rise of the next Hamas.
Thank you Israel 👏 you have indeed saved us all 👏 👏 /s
Counter-attacking a belligerent nation != thinking itself god. You keep making these absurd statements…
That’s how war works. You think it’s all hugs and love in a war? What if one of them have a suicide bomb belt? You might want to look into how US army treats the locals in Iraq war. Every war has war crimes(so far I don’t see any committed by Israel). Every war has civilian casualties. Some people are fixated on civilians death from bombings. Well, if they are bombing Hamas targets and there are civilians, that’s just how any country would have done it. US did the same. Any country would do the same. So let’s get off your high horse and start criticizing both sides. I haven’t heard any liberals pointing finger at the Hamas. It’s sickening.
That other countries would do it too does in no way make it morally justified, it just makes those countries monstrous as well.
Hamas are horrible terrorists. There, your first liberal pointing a finger at Hamas. Now, consider what the point of critique is. Will Hamas ever care about western criticism? No. Will Israel ever care? Maybe. They depend on Western support in their political and economic stability. Therefore continued scrutiny and criticism of Israel has a chance of actually making a difference.
Oh hey, sure. I can tell you exactly how we did it in Iraq. On both counts. So when you first make contact with the person you’re going to detain you have them stop at a distance. Then someone with a thermal sight looks at them through the sight and it’s readily apparent if they have a bomb vest on. I mean there’s no chance of not seeing it. But it could be something like a money belt or an armor vest. So you have them disrobe if, and only if, the guy with the thermal sight says it needs to happen. At that point if it is a vest and they’re cooperative it’s an EOD problem. If they aren’t cooperative, well that sucks.
The key thing here though, is in the 99.9 percent of cases it’s not a vest, or there was no positive indication, they keep their fucking clothes. Just like your local PD is capable of searching you without stripping you, so is your friendly neighborhood infantry platoon.
Now about bombing. Before you can drop any ordinance you have to first answer a few questions.
*Is this structure currently being used by the enemy?
*Are there signs of civilians, or is it somewhere we would reasonably expect them to be? (Such as an apartment)
*Is this structure on the protected targets list? (Oh yeah we spent time creating lists of things not to shoot at if possible.)
If the answer is yes to the first and any of the others we then also need to figure out if it rises to a level where bombing it is appropriate. For example, bombing an apartment building because there’s 12 guys there is a war crime. But if there’s a Battalion dug in there, then yeah it’s legitimate.
What Israel has been doing is scanning satellite and drone footage for anything that looks like it could be the entrance hatch to a tunnel and bombing that. No matter where it is and with no evidence as to whether it’s a maintenance tunnel or the yet to be found super secret bad guy hang out. If I did that in Iraq I’d have been brought up on charges. They tried to bring me up on charges for firing a warning shot. So please tell me more about how, this is just the way it’s done. I’ll be over here shining my CIB, waiting for the answer.
I’m not the person you asked this question to but wanted to answer anyway:
*Is this structure currently being used by the enemy?
No. It was a refugee camp.
*Are there signs of civilians, or is it somewhere we would reasonably expect them to be? (Such as an apartment)
Yes
*Is this structure on the protected targets list? (Oh yeah we spent time creating lists of things not to shoot at if possible.)
Not sure about the list Israel has, but yeah refugee camps should be in there.
Israel has practically assassinated so many doctors in Gaza by killing them all when they return home to check on their families. 16 of them died in their own home, not in service, with a large portion of their families. Israel knows what it’s doing. It knows where targets and non-targets are… it’s just that they decided that medical professionals and 4 year old girls are targets.
Every single time Israel commits a war crime someone is like “tHatS jUsT wAr oKay?”
That’s not what Israel said about October 7th is it?
So why should be Palestinians settle for it?
So why should be Palestinians settle for it?
Because they don’t have the means to fight back and win. Because if they insist on intifada they will end up with nothing.
Oh the mental equilibristics to try to excuse war crimes and clear dehumanization from Israel. Seriously you should ask what kind of a person you are if you defend them.
Maybe address the arguments being made rather than the ones making them. Not everyone thinks these are war crimes, and whatever dehumanization you see here could very well be for security reasons and not Abu Ghraib style psychological warfare.
