This is a fucking childish take. If you don’t like what Google is doing with Chromium that’s one thing, but acting as if the code itself is evil is just straight-up magical thinking.
Chromium is controlled by Google.
Browsers down steam on Chromium will either pull from chromium or fork from it.
They hold >75% of global browser market share.
They make a change, like enforcing Web Environment Integrity API, you either comply or your competing chromium browser will.
@Spudwart @lolcatnip, wrong, Chromium is FOSS and every browsercompany is free to gutt it out and modify it to their like, it’s not more controlled by Google than Gecko with several Google devs working in Mozilla on Firefox.
The Problem is Google itself with it’s imperialistic behavior in internet, not which browser you use. This is precisely why he invented this WEI crap, because previous attempts to control it through Browser engine APIs didn’t work.
Sure, in theory.
But putting in the work to maintain a Chromium fork whose engine significantly differs from upstream? Especially over time as more changes are made that you’ll want to remove, and new features you DO want rely on some you DON’T…
Takes a lot of dev time/money.
Realistically other than Microsoft I don’t think any of the alternative Chromium browsers have the resources.
And most users are going to be on a browser fully confirming to pretty much all engine changes Google makes.
In reality, the larger Chromium’s market share - the bigger Google’s iron fist on web development.
Google accounts for some 80%+ of Mozilla’s revenue. Firefox struck a different kind of deal with the devil than chromium browsers, but Google is the one pulling the strings.
What narrative? Firefox is the only browser google doesn’t fully control. It’s the only choice if you don’t support the google monopoly.
Well, there’s Safari but that’s for apple only, and technically they don’t really control chromium-based browsers - they’d have to do yet another cycle of EEE to actually kill of competition. And firefox can survive without google for a while by downsizing massively and focusing on chinese market as they still have that baidu deal AFAIK.
But overall, yes, Google has in fact cemented themselves as the middlemen for all things internet, on both mobile and desktop.
For default search.
I’m sure you’re aware Firefox isn’t in the search market. They are in the browser market and need to fund browser development. They’ve used Yahoo in the past and will go with whatever deal gives the best value. They could go with Bing if they wanted.
Funding from them does not mean control, and your insinuation is misleading and false.
Bit of a weird thought, but I wonder also if they see Mozilla as a sort of controlled opposition too? As in, keep Firefox around so they don’t get in trouble over antitrust or something like that?
Mozilla.org is the corpse of Netscape that Google keeps animated so that it looks like they have competition when they really don’t.
The existence of Firefox is something they can point to to say they’re not a monopoly. The fact that 80% of the revenue Firefox receives is from Google means that Google effectively controls them. Mozilla has to weigh every decision against the risk that it will cause Google to withdraw their funding. That severely restricts the choices they’re willing to consider.
Firefox is only 5% of browsers, so it really doesn’t matter to Google if that 5% of users considers using a different search engine. Because of the Firefox user base, many of them will have already switched search engines, and because Google is such a dominant player, many others would switch back to Google if the browser used a different default. So, maybe 10% of that 5% would permanently switch search engines if Google stopped paying. Is that really worth billions per year? Probably not. But, pretending like you have competitors in the browser space and using that to push back on antitrust, that’s definitely worth billions per year.
Google makes something like $100 Billion a year in search ad revenue. 5% of that is $5 Billion.
It’s odd that people think Google is incredibly worried about having too large of a market share in the browser market (which they don’t make any money from) yet their 92% market share in searches is not concerning at all in terms of the potential for regulation.
The truth is nobody does anti-trust anymore (though they definitely should) and the big corporations aren’t worried at all about it. Google makes Chrome, Android, and pays Mozilla because they want to maintain dominance in the search market. Which is the thing they make money form. What they pay Mozilla is a drop in the bucket compared to what they pay Apple to be the default search engine on their devices.
Google pays Mozilla in exchange for google being Firefox’s default search engine
I see that as an okay compromise. Anyone who cares will also know how to change it easily.
Do you have any examples of how google is pulling the strings at Mozilla ?
For an example, Mozilla being forced to use Google Location Services as default even though Mozilla has its own. I am also a Firefox user but it always makes me wonder what other TnCs forced on Mozilla as part of the search deal.
I mean brave is fine. I use firefox and brave and tor browser and mullvad browser. There isn’t anything too bad about brave though
Firefox is kept alive by Google default search money AFAIK otherwise why don’t they sue google for showing different search results page in firefox
They do have an extension that forces the new search results page, but I’ve noticed it freezes the browser if I tap on an image result, so I have it disabled.
Am I the only one who doesn’t get the hate on chromium? I mean it’s fast, it works and nobody forces you to use Google’s proprietary chrome. You can use anything you want
Google, or let say the Chromium group, can easily implement “features” that are already present in proprietary Google Chrome, and easily control the Internet and its users’ personalized settings.
Indeed, Chromium-built browsers have smooth user experience and simplicity, but at what cost?
Competition will be dead.
Yes but no, there are 2 options you either submit a commit and chromium can accept that code or you fork the project and then you have to maintain it and add features yourself. So while they could it would require a ton more effort to keeping it up to datw
IMHO nobody sane hates a technology.
The big problem is Chromes and Googles dominance over the internet. Even at this moment, there are sites that don’t work with Firefox/alternate browsers at all.
Stating that people can use alternative browsers is theoretically correct, but in reality one is forced to have a Chromium based browser installed for the websites/services one has to access. (My main browser is Firefox and I have a Chromium backup browser on every device, not by my choice.)
Combine this with the push of Google to prevent adblocking and centralize control of the internet at one place, and we are on our way to a real shit show.
You can happily search for the history of Internet Explorer in the 2000s, for a taste of what is yet to come.
In case Googles agenda has not affected you, yet, you should really ponder if
a.) Googles agenda will never affect you negatively in the future b.) Googles agenda will never affect people you care about in the future
In the end, I don’t hate Chrome, Chromium or any other browser based on this technology. I really don’t like the direction things are developing and I remember the monopolies of the past in IT, which were only of benefit for the monopolists.
Okay. But google controls chromium, and everything that goes in it. And they’re using that control to change how the internet works. So just saying that “chromium is a problem” can be considered a useful shorthand so you don’t have to explain that every time.
Well they don’t directly force you to use it, but when basically all of the most popular browsers (including the default browser of Windows) are Chromium based, that means that developers optimize their sites for that first and foremost. And combined with Google’s amp protocol, which adds control for them, it means that they can dictate many terms for these other companies. It’s like sure, you can use Vimeo to upload your video, but who the hell is gonna see it when there’s YouTube? Same thing here, why use some other standard (such as what Firefox is doing) when the support for Chromium is that much greater, even though it’s more restrictive in others.
