Please start your comments with the following question answered at the top:
“Will you vote for Biden in the 2024 election?” [Y/N]
One side is working to dismantle democracy. The other side is not. If you don’t vote blue you are enabling Republicans to enact Project 2025. You would enable Republicans to take away rights from LGBT people in America. You would enable abortion bans and enable even more of the genocide in Gaza. You would enable Republicans to do all the types of stuff listed in the meme, and they will try.
I am convinced some of the far left that won’t vote for Biden because of the war in Gaza are being influenced by Republicans. I wouldn’t be surprised if some of those people are Republicans trying to get people not to vote for Biden. It may not be an ideal situation, but if you don’t vote for Biden because you think he is handling the war in Gaza horribly, you are doing exactly what the Republicans want you to do. Maybe someday we’ll be able to vote for someone better than him. But for now, you have to understand the reality of our two party system, and deal with it. At the very least, don’t do what the Republicans would want you to do: staying home rather than going out and voting for Biden
For all their many flaws: Democrats leave office without attempting coups when they lose.
They support candidates in the other party that do attempts coups, just so voters are forced to vote for them instead of the other party. Hilary’s support for Trump in the primaries, should be seen as threat of violence towards the voters and seen as fascism. All the problems with Trump are problems that Democrates are to blame. They are not responsible for other Republicans maybe, but they are responsible for Trump. Trump is a Democrate candidate in the Republican party.
In 2020, 80 million didn’t vote. How do you fix that?
Bullshit. Democrats have made their disdain for democracy absolutely clear by preventing other candidates from even getting on the ballot in the primaries. I’m not defending Trump, but if Biden loses, he has only himself and the other ghouls in the Democratic party to blame. You can’t run on protecting democracy while simultaneously sabotaging it.
It’s not on the voters to hold their noses and vote for someone who should probably be in a nursing home and very likely won’t live long enough to finish his second term. It’s on the Democratic party to allow candidates people want to vote for to participate. All this blaming of voters for wanting to sit this one out or vote third party is just so much bootlicking of the establishment.
One side is working to dismantle democracy. The other side is not.
WHAT DEMOCRACY ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? The one that enables your country to fund a genocide across the globe DESPITE the outrage of it’s citizens and the… WHOLE WORLD?
You would enable Republicans to take away rights from LGBT people in America. You would enable abortion bans and enable even more of the genocide in Gaza.
How you can enable MORE genocide? People are finite, you either commit genocide, or you don’t. Or you think with your tiny fucking libbrain that SMALL GENOCIDE is totally okay?
But for now, you have to understand the reality of our two party system, and deal with it.
Yeah, sure, do not try to change anything, just deal with our shitty system because there’s no other option. Jesus fucking Christ…
The electoral Congress decides who’s president, though. Why shouldn’t I as a far-leftist vote third party to express my discontentment with a democratic party that only wants to appeal to the right? I’m tired of people telling me Biden is good enough when we had a actual progressive who had a shot just a few years ago. The climate can’t wait, and the Palestinian people certainly can’t. A placid, centrist left in the face of fascism looks useless to me I’m not sorry. Read a fucking history book.
People often say that voting third party is throwing away your vote, but using your vote as a protest like you describe is perfectly valid. Politicians from the major parties do care about how they can appeal to swingable voters, and third parties getting more votes does makes them more influential for future policy. You give up having influence between the two people who actually have a chance in the current election, but realistically you didn’t in the first place if you don’t live in a battleground state.
It’s your vote. Don’t let other people chide you for not spending it on what they think you should. Just use it for a cause that’s worthwhile to you. It’s the people who don’t vote at all that get ignored.
Fuck I needed to hear that, thanks. I just believe a lot of Biden voters are relentlessly optimistic and more than a little naive- there’s a lot of propaganda afoot lately but I think it’s important to talk about my choice too. Obviously we need things like ranked-choice voting for third party votes in this country to make a real difference ASAP but IIRC if a party’s candidate gets even 5% of the vote in a election they qualify for some federal funding. I don’t think it’s impossible to fight for better representation and win in the long run that way.
You had an actual progressive years ago…yes. You don’t have one this year.
You say the climate can’t wait…so which path is better: 1 - push for net-zero carbon emissions by 2050, invest $2T in green tech and infrastructure, OR 2 - boost oil and gas production, roll back environmental regulations
Palestine can’t wait…which path is better: 1 - publicly support Israel while pressuring them to limit civilian casualties, work towards a cease fire OR 2 - sending ICE to break up pro-Palestinian protests in the US to remove any protesters here illegally, implement ideological screening as part of the immigration process, stoke anti-muslim sentiment here and abroad.
Read a fucking history book? The Repub is using the same power-consolidation strategy as Hitler, there’s Nazis chilling at cpac, LGBTQ folks are being targeted by Republicans across the country, burning books, politicians changing the contents of history curriculum…they say history doesn’t repeat itself but it sure does rhyme. Well, this is straight-up plagiarism.
Yes because there are two paths, only two. Revolution is never a option and we should eat ALLLLL the shit they feed us, thankful for scraps as the fires burn more and more intense. 2050? Do you hear yourself? The damage is already irreparable, that’s far too late. We need action now and a president who hasn’t sold their soul to oil, if such a thing could ever possibly exist. I AM lgbt (trans) and IMHO this is a problem because he’s looking out for conservative billionaires instead. I tell you to look at the history because I agree, the Republicans are Nazis… And a centrist left conceded power to them or had it stolen then too.
Voting for a third party with no chance of winning takes away a vote from the candidate from the 2 major parties who more closely represents you.
You’re not just doing a protest. If you believe in left values, you’re making it one vote harder for the left to win and one vote easier for the right.
Would you rather the opposition win and we lose democracy or more rights so you can prove your point?
It’s downright selfish imho.
If you believe in left values, you’re making it one vote harder for the left to win and one vote easier for the right.
democrats, especially joe biden, are not on the left
Voting for a third party with no chance of winning takes away a vote from the candidate from the 2 major parties who more closely represents you
no it doesn’t. the vote belongs to the voter, and they can give it to any candidate they like. the votes are not owned by the 2 major parties.
Liberals aren’t left. I like this take by Phil Ochs
"In every American community, you have varying shades of political opinion. One of the shadiest of these is the liberals. An outspoken group on many subjects. Ten degrees to the left of center in good times, ten degrees to the right of center if it affects them personally.
I cried when they shot Medgar Evers
Tears ran down my spine
And I cried when they shot Mr. Kennedy
As though I’d lost a father of mine
But Malcolm X got what was coming
He got what he asked for this time
So love me, love me, love me, I’m a liberal
Get it?"
The democrats are worse than the republicans because they’re letting them enact horrible republican policies
Make it make sense
the democrats are fundamentally closer to republicans in status and solidarity than they are to most working class americans that they claim to represent.
he also did fuck all about east palestine and let norfolk southern run the show
?
They had to pay for all the remediation, which is not just a slap on the wrist.
I don’t disagree with the intended meaning of any of this
However, it would be more effective with increased clarity if the text were revised to state that he “Didn’t expand the Supreme Court beyond nine, and did not appoint those additional new justices” or even simply “Did not increase the size of the Supreme Court” or something like that. Because he did appoint Kentanji Brown Jackson to SCOTUS, and people will point that out under your current writing of it which will derail discussion of the actual points. Revising the text will foreclose the possibility of that derailment
4 of these are just, ‘he failed to do more to undo the Republican’s party’s efforts’.
How is it that republicans are so much more effective than democrats? Before you use the tired excuse of “it’s easier to break things than to make things” tell me why biden can’t break this support of genocide.
as far as the border goes, theres no excuse for continuing trump era immigration policy that was, oh shit, already in place before even trump took office. dems don’t care about the migrants affected by climate change that US actions have caused. kamala literally got on a microphone telling migrants to “not come to america” I mean this is the party saying they are gonna save us from fascism but we gotta make sure we vote. democrats like to say that they are everything the republicans aren’t. maybe they aren’t certain things but they are still classist as fuck and would let us die before their colleagues in DC do. maybe they want to keep trumps border policy cause of the growing republican latinx community which is in part due to inaction from the democrats fumbling over themselves and failing to make any meaningful change
One side is working to dismantle democracy. The other side is not.
Both “sides” don’t give a fuck about people or democracy, both the red and blue party support dictatorships around the world, genocide and unjust wars. If you vote red or blue you are giving your vote to corrupted criminal murderers with blood on their hands. If i don’t support Stalin in WWII it does not mean that i’m supporting Hitler, the choice is yours! Not voting for red or blue does NOT mean voting for the other color.
Wait… You were against the allies in World War II? Are you one of those Charles Lindbergh leftists I keep hearing about?
Are you pro russia?
You can be against Hitler and Stalin at the same time they were both awful dictatiors. Life it’s not a football match you don’t have to pick a side
If my choices are veiled fascism or open fascism I’d rather have it out in the open so we can fight it.
If we’re willing to condone genocide by an ally then we’re willing to condone one here. And the reason it’s called veiled is because they have the same goals, they’re just shy about saying it out loud.
The far left isn’t voting because electoral politics are a distraction from actual revolutionary action. While y’all are too busy choosing the lesser evil that will eventually “compromise” with the worse evil because “we need a strong republican party” the far left is taking more direct approaches.
What a load of self righteous nonsense. Even if anyone believed you, it takes a couple hours out of a day to vote at absolute maximum. I think the revolution can spare that, no?
Yeah voting is something that happens, at most, twice a year - with primaries and the general. So a total of 2 hours a year is really a immaterial use of time and effort
staying home rather than going out and voting for Biden
I’m not going to stay home. I’m going to go to the polling place and leave that part empty on the ballot.
Here’s the bottom line: I cannot bring myself to officially support someone who I admit is an active supporter of genocide. Listen to yourselves. You are literally saying that I should feel bad because I won’t support someone who is actively supporting genocide. They are carpet bombing children, intentionally starving them, denying them medical care, all because of their ethnicity. He is expediting military aid to make sure they can.
I wouldn’t vote for Hitler just because I believed his opponent was worse. The reason I wouldn’t vote for Hitler is because of the genocide. I have to draw a line somewhere. If anything, I should probably have drawn it somewhere before genocide.
BTW, I’m not saying you’re a bad person if you do vote for Biden, or even that I’m somehow better for not. I get it. I just can’t bring myself to do it.
[Edit: Americans, if you’re thinking of replying to me, consider instead or additionally going to Ceasefire Now and writing to your representatives. Maybe if there’s an end to the genocide before November I’ll be willing to vote for Biden.]
You are a bad person if you don’t vote against Trump, who is the actual comparison to Hitler.
I’m voting against Trump and Biden. biden spent 50 years in power making trump possible.
I hope you gain the knowledge to see the bigger picture before November. Allowing Trump to win guarantees that the genocide continues and even grows. Biden, at least, is reasonable and not bloodthirsty. Work with the system so that you can change it. Because the alternative is to burn us all down for your own hubris and lack of awareness.
Allowing Trump to win guarantees that the genocide continues and even grows.
Allowing Biden to win guarantees that the genocide continues and even grows.
Biden, at least, is reasonable and not bloodthirsty.
“Reasonable and not bloodthirsty”: expediting military aid to help the slaughter of children.
Work with the system so that you can change it.
Nothing I am doing is outside the system, and voting for Biden won’t help change the system.
I hope you gain the knowledge to see the bigger picture before November… Because the alternative is to burn us all down for your own hubris and lack of awareness.
Hubris is thinking that because other people disagree with you they must be ignorant and lack awareness. Hubris is thinking that if other people act differently from you, we will all burn down.
You don’t consider canceling primaries for a state that habitual votes against party favorite to be dismantling democracy?
Not even a couple cycles after the dnc’s lawyer told a judge primary votes don’t matter and they can appoint anyone and the judge agreed?
They’re not equally bad, but at this point it’s hard to call either democratic
Which will depress turnout, even if the people trying to earn you still vote for Biden
so, out of curiosity, what has biden accomplished (or any one, really,) done to stop any of that?
so far, the only thing he’s successfully achieved is… increasing the DoJ’s focus on domestic terrorism. which, is something, I guess.
After three years of this shit getting worse; why should we believe Biden is able to actually stop it and protect our democracy? it took him two and half, or so, years for him to get the DoJ to assign Jack Smith to investigate trump for Jan 6, and documents, and stuff.
Under Biden we have student load forgiveness, we have a better ftc that actually investigates shit, we had an actual climate deal, and we have support for Ukraine, and have an investigation on trump. With trump we have none of that. We get total facism.
Also voting and protest/revolt are not mutually exclusive. At least under Biden we might not have to become a full on fascist state in the next year.
Under Biden we have student load forgiveness, we have a better ftc that actually investigates shit, we had an actual climate deal, and we have support for Ukraine, and have an investigation on trump. With trump we have none of that. We get total facism.
Most of the Climate deals are corporate subsidies for things they were going to do anyhow… eventually.
As good as the student debt forgiveness is… all of those loans that are being forgiven are loans that should have been forgiven ages ago. There’s zero fraud investigation on that. just a “oops. we let you get scammed for years.” (sometimes even decades.). Not exactly a brilliant dipslay of … governance.
Right now we don’t even have support for ukraine. so much for that much-vaunted bipartisanship that was one of his key sales pitches.
Also voting and protest/revolt are not mutually exclusive. At least under Biden we might not have to become a full on fascist state in the next year.
you do realize that prevailing rhetoric right now is “Don’t protest Biden now… let him win the election first!”, right? which is why I’m being down voted when I call Gaza Genocide.
I don’t think Biden can protect american democracy. I don’t think he has that ability.
So, he’s done nothing to actually protect american democracy. The argument being made by the OC is that he’s protecting American democracy. Where’s that?
your source is mostly about stuff that Biden has fuck all to do with (crime is state and local; Economics, fed and treasury;) and the stuff he does… he’s not done all that much (immigration?) or has gone the wrong way (oil)
Man I just want to vote for a better candidate not strategically vote so the worst one doesn’t get elected. Why tf isn’t Trump in jail yet
They had four years to prosecute him. At some point they’re either stalling to make it an election issue, which is disgusting, or they’re trying to run out the clock on the public’s anger so they can look effective while avoiding angering his base. Which is also disgusting.
Trump has been prosecuted. This kind of slow process isn’t unusual like you’re implying, though. It’s the norm for our system of justice.
Oh are the trials done? Did they decide to declare him not guilty and not tell the news?
Trials usually take a week. You’re telling me that nowhere in the last four years we’ve had the evidence we could find a week to do it?
Because if Biden moved any faster there’d have been zero reason to vote for Biden in 2024…
There should be zero reason to vote for Biden because he said he would be a 1 term president and should have used the time to push new voices of other members of the Democrat party up into the spotlight while working on big policy plans even if they wouldn’t go through.
Instead even the vice president disappeared of the face of the earth and the DNC is considering Governors Newsom and Whitmer as replacements for Biden if he dies in office.
They waste so much time and do so little to actually make an impact in the minds of voters.
he said he would be a 1 term president
No, he didn’t. Other people, who had absolutely no say in what Biden would do, said he wouldn’t run again.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/474059-biden-campaign-denies-one-term-report/
This comment is so full of misinformation that I have to assume it is a GOP psyop
They’re obsessed with money because they forget money isn’t the end goal.
Sure, it might cost millions of dollars to convince someone to eat a shit sandwich. But if the real goal is just getting them to eat, you could probably just give them a free pizza.
They compromise shitty candidates for donations to convince people to vote for the shitty candidate. But those compromises for donor money means they now need more do or money. It’s a never ending cycle
If you mention we could just run a good candidate and need less money they start screeching. Because they like the lifestyle of being important and having wealthy connected people suck up to them.
Trump will for sure encourage a true genocode of palestine. remember the kurds he abandoned to Syria/Putin? remember the muslim ban?
This is the insane part to me. Everyone is just jumping on the opportunity to cheapen the word genocide, so when Trump gets a roll, I guess we will have to come up with a whole new word. Super genocide? Genocide, but not like that other one? Genocide with seven pieces of flair?
Dude, Bush abandoned the Kurds; Clinton ignored them; Bush Junior used and abandoned them again; Obama did it a third time; Then Trump did it.
Hell I wouldn’t even be surprised if the US abandoned them again. They aren’t. They told us in 2003 that our leaders would abandon them but they were thankful for the temporary help.
Wtf you saying? A lot more happened in syria under trump than before him. Barack was wasting time allowing isis to grow. And once isis was defeated america pulled out. Probably one of the few good news that came out of syria. What did biden do? he put sanctions that were supposed to hurt assad, but instead hurt the people who can barely afford to eat.
Don’t forget getting rid of Medicare, raising taxes on people making under $90,000 a year, dismantling the IRS, and just full on fascism.
Don’t forget defunding EPA and clean water programs, and the delay/added damage is costing a lot more in American tax monies. Except it’s during the Dems term so Republicans are happy to make things expensive, and whine about it until they can get back into office and do nothing about it.
the united states officially supports apartheid on multiple occasions. private entities in the united states supported fascists and nazi’s alike and there is a new iteration of them taking the stage. the democrats are not really stopping them now are they? how would trump simultaneously raise taxes and dismantle the agency that collects those taxes? wut? there are people making less 10k/year under a democratic majority. you explain to them why they should care that people making 80k are gonna get taxed more? especially when those 80k/year people ignore or denigrate the people working harder than them for less and don’t even have the social standing to bitch about it effectively
“Will you vote for Biden in the 2024 election?” Yes
Maybe I’m just getting old, but I have no problem seeing the vast difference between the two choices we’re going to be given in November.
No matter how much the children in the room piss and moan, there are realistically only two choices - 3rd party candidates only exist to spoil it for whomever they’re ideologically closer to of the two “real” candidates. Furthermore, Biden has turned out better than I expected - and I’m a Bernie Sanders kinda guy!
I guess I’m the opposite. I hate how the DNC torpedoed Bernie in 2020 and will not forgive them until they support someone more progressive.
I make a decent amount and am fairly confident in my job security (even with the rapid pace of LLM’s). So I’m fine watching the world burn for the next 4 years.
So I’m fine watching the world burn for the next 4 years.
hey at least you’re honest about it, fuck em, you got yours fuck everyone else.
I mean it’s despicable and heartless but honest af.
lol. Supposedly a Bernie supporter, presumably so that we could get closer to getting people what they need (ex: single payer healthcare, etc).
“I’m fine with watching the world burn”
Hmmm. Something isn’t adding up here.
