We are witnessing a modern day red scare
I really, really do not want to be lumped in with Zionists.
I don’t agree at all with what’s happened to the Palestinians at Israel’s hands, and I have no trouble saying both Zionists and Israeli govt are wrong here.
I have never visited Israel for how toxic Zionists ironically sounded, considering our history in Germany, and I’m damn glad I never will. You’re making us all look bad, you fucking idiots.
Agreed. I’m Jewish but I’m American. I’m not Israeli. I don’t support Israel’s apartheid or its genocide. I’ve never cared much about Israel in terms of my “heritage” and I’ve never even been especially interested in visiting beyond wanting to see some of the archaeology.
I am so tired of being associated with Israel and it’s Israel’s fault.
So criticizing a country that has assassinated American citizens is now a crime. Fucking wow
The article says:
The measure passed in a 320-91 vote. Twenty-one Republicans and 70 Democrats voted against the legislation.
The bill, titled the Antisemitism Awareness Act, would mandate that the Education Department adopt the broad definition of antisemitism used by the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance, an intergovernmental group, to enforce anti-discrimination laws.
The international group defines antisemitism as a “certain perception of Jews, which may be expressed as hatred toward Jews.” The group adds that “rhetorical and physical manifestations” of antisemitism include such things as calling for the killing or harming of Jews or holding Jews collectively responsible for actions taken by the state of Israel.
This seems good at first glance, as it clearly separates Israel and Judaism, which would be very clearly against the views of Netanyahu and his conservative government. My only issue is that it could be interpreted differently to give IHRA the agency to change their definitions, and they’re not generally unbiased when dealing with Israel. They had a highly controversial list of “examples of antisemitism” which defended Israel with fervor.
as it clearly separates Israel and Judaism
What are you talking about? The definition CLEARLY combines Israel and Judaism into one category, as in, any criticism of Israel becomes antisemitic hate speech.
Have you even actually read the definition?
You seem to have trouble reading the text you’re replying to. I’ll paste if a few more times to make it easier for you.
The international group defines antisemitism as a “certain perception of Jews, which may be expressed as hatred toward Jews.” The group adds that “rhetorical and physical manifestations” of antisemitism include such things as calling for the killing or harming of Jews or holding Jews collectively responsible for actions taken by the state of Israel.
The group adds that “rhetorical and physical manifestations” of antisemitism include such things as calling for the killing or harming of Jews or holding Jews collectively responsible for actions taken by the state of Israel.
holding Jews collectively responsible for actions taken by the state of Israel.
holding Jews collectively responsible for actions taken by the state of Israel.
The key text:
Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g. by claiming that the existence of a state of Israel is a racist endeavor.
This is where the slight of hand happens. The problem with self determination is that we don’t live in an empty world. My right to self determination can’t impinge on your right to self determination. So this definition doesn’t take into account competing political projects, agendas etc. This is about Israel, but notice they start with denying the Jewish people the right to self determination, then the example they give is claiming that the state of Israel is a racist endeavor. Now Judaism is conflated with political Zionism. These two things are not the same. And people have a right to believe that creating Israel is ok. But I have a right and you have a right to disagree that the formation of Israel was morally OK, politically acceptable. I can say that creating Israel came at the expense, of the Palestinian people. And that the creation of an ethnostate as such affords Israelis different rights whether or not you’re Jewish. And I don’t have to support the principal of an ethnostate. I dont belive in kurdish ethnostates, I don’t believe in white nationlist ethnostates, I dont believe in Arab or Islamic ethnostates, and I don’t believe in Jewish ethnostates.
I can say that. Unless we follow this definition.
for reference: the actual definition (if you can get it to load its getting the internet hug of death): https://holocaustremembrance.com/resources/working-definition-antisemitism
and the bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/7921
I assume “calling for the killing or harming of Jews” is meant in the general sense. But what happens if it’s directed at one person, who happens to be Jewish. Let’s say the individual is a criminal and people wish harm upon them. Would that count?
I feel like the illegality of threatening to murder a specific person was never really in question regardless of legislature waiting on the Senate’s approval,
But Fuck Netanyahu
Calling for the killing or harming of someone is not the same as threatening someone.
For example, I would never say “I’m going to kill Netanyahu”, but I AM aware of the FACT that the world would become a better place if someone, for example himself, did.
Likewise, it’s always been illegal to threaten Jewish people, just like anyone else, but this law is at the very least a step towards criminalizing all criticism of the actions of a fascist apartheid regime by equating Israel and by extension its government with all Jewish people, which is itself a very antisemitic thing to do.
Saying someone is “a Jew” rather than saying that they’re “Jewish” often comes off as vaguely antisemitic. I’m not saying that it’s wrong, just something subtle I’ve noticed over the years.
Really? (Really asking)
It’s not considered offensive for other religions as far as I know… “Peter is a Christian” has zero derogatory connotation
I mean the first point is that there’s not much history of widespread systematic anti-christian sentiment in the western world. Secondly, I’ve noticed antisemitic people tend to say “… is a jew” with a particular intonation even when they’re not speaking negatively about someone. In text format where tone isn’t able to be conveyed, I’ve noticed that people are more likely to react negatively.
Maybe I’m wrong, though. 🤷♂️ I’m a stranger on the internet, and you probably shouldn’t take my word at face value.
