Trump and Vance are bullies. The kind of damage this will do to the PR of the USA is incalculable.
Will there be anymore goodwill for the USA?
I mean, if the position of the country can change to such an insane degree by the results of a single election cycle then a lot of that goodwill that was given prior, should be examined.
That’s the sad fact of the matter. Trump and Vance and Elon and the rest of the administration are a fucking catastrophe, yes. But what is even worse than that, what is even more damaging for the long term viability of diplomacy, of international relations and governance, is that even when these clowns are gone, it can happen again.
Every time another country signs a trade deal, an alliance, a pact, an agreement of any sort with the US, even if the current leadership is absolutely incredible, that can change dramatically on a dime within 4 years. That has always been true, of course, but historically the precedent has been that new administrations are largely consistent in upholding international agreements. But a new precedent has been set, that agreements (aka “sheets” as the dumbass calls them) are worthless, that they can be torn up on a whim, that peace may require you to fluff the ego of a megalomaniac and kiss his feet, that you might have to placate idiocy and bravado and STILL have your economy rocked by asinine trade policies, that the threat of invasion and war could be a negotiation tactic for trade deals…
Countries are going to completely detach themselves from the US in all matters, and they absolutely should. We are going be turned into a North Korea-like state. Cut off from world trade and information, no diplomacy, just a looming threat to the whole world. Fuck me, this shit is bleak.
It won’t go so far as being like North Korea. But there are countries out there that don’t get good trade deals because of this exact problem. We will have to pay more for every trade deal we make for the next 30 years because other countries can’t be sure we’ll keep our end of it. It’s just like getting a loan with a bad credit rating. You can still get the loan but the bank is going to demand more compensation because of the risk.
I think that so many things are going to get fucked up between now and then that we would need a constitutional convention just reweave the threads of our society.
Congress can’t legislate its way out of this mess anymore.
It can happen again? This is “it” happening again. We suffered you guys having a first trump administration, we thought you learned, but you elected him even harder the second time.
You’re being too pessimistic. Alliances have always been about being strange bedfellows that’ll stab each other in the back should the proper conditions ever be met.
No matter how kissy-kissy politicians may be in front of a camera, backroom dealing is still the norm. Only the orange guy mistook the backroom with a toilet and so it stinks of shit for everyone to see.
Whatever the end result of this, whoever’s left afterwards will get back to tender intimacies without a hitch.
How much longer before the US loses the hegemony of the dollar as a reserve currency do you think?
I’ll be honest with you guys… my wife and I (Australian) had a three-week holiday to America planned for June which I just cancelled last week because I don’t want to give you a single fucking dollar.
We’re going to Japan now instead.
I don’t blame you, I just hope you all remember that this is being done to us by state actors, chiefly the Russians. We’ve given them the tools to do it with - our freedom of speech and the Internet, but I just hope you understand they are leveraging the stupidest among us to do all of this.
Russians are gonna Russian, but this was done to you by 77 million of your own citizens that voted for the known criminal and traitor, and the millions who didn’t bother to vote at all. And many of them are cheering even today.
Russians have been trying this all over Europe and they can’t get past 30% in France or 20% in Germany.
The tools are the Republicans slashing education for decades so people stay dumb. Mission accomplished, apparently.
I have zero faith that Trump and Vance will do anything that favors ongoing world peace and/or limiting Russian Aggression, instead I believe Trump and Vance will serve their own interest by selling out Ukraine and baking up a scheme that will gain favor of their Russian buddies, who control an amazing amount of wealth for a country with such a high poverty rate.
How long till we send troops into Ukraine? I don’t mean as allies. Reagan is spinning in his grave. (Don’t get me wrong, a grave is where he belongs, but he’d be pretty burned about this)
Trump said one thing thats true, “You’re in a bad position right now, and you don’t have the cards…”, Ukraine doesn’t have the economy to put up a lasting ongoing fight with Russia, especially if they’re getting troop support from North Korea
 I think we should pour every surplus American weapon we have and donated to Ukraine immediately and then we need the pressure people who purchase oil and natural gas for my ran and Russia and forced them into some sort of economic sanction  Then we need to take all the F 35s that we paid billions and billion dollars and development money for and deploy them to the eastern European sector and put up a no fly zone
But, I am just an internet shit poster who got banned from Reddit.
Will there be anymore goodwill for the USA?
As an American, my hopes and prayers are that the World will remember that approximately half of us are being held hostage inside of the clown car, and are being forced to go along for the ride.
Only 22% of the total US population voted for Orange McBurger. Don’t forget that.
Which makes me wonder, what is the breaking point for 78% of Americans, before they start burning it down, and building guillotines in front of ever federal building?
This is dispicable American apologetics. All those that didn’t vote are equally as guilty. America spoke and it said we are a hateful bigoted and foolish nation. Don’t forget that.
Yeah, but I was quoting that “approximately half of us” number based on multiple polls, over time, and not just voting.
The nation is approximately 45% / 45% / 10%, in their belief systems.
In a very real sense we really are two nations occupying the same landmass.
I don’t know if anyone will remember this, but way back in the ?late 80s?, back before the Internet, there was a TV mini series on ABC, where the Soviet Union invaded America, and won.
And there’s a scene in that movie, at the end, where there’s a couple of Soviet top military persons, and they’re in front of a map of the US, and the US is split into multiple zones, with names like “Homeland”, etc.
Then the one Soviet person askes the other Soviet person about how they will maintain control of the country.
The other Soviet person talks about how the US it’s not just one people, but is just really groups of people, split in different area, divided, so they’ll be easy to control and suppress.
I keep thinking back to that movie, and specifically to that scene, when I see what’s going on today in the world.
About how we’re divided, with everyone just looking out for themselves.
Edit: Here we go. What I described is discussed in the “Climax and resolution” and “The Divided States of America” sections of that article/page.
Looking from a country bordering russia, the amount of goodwill towards the US has little weight. We have to carefully consider how and what we can trust. Short term business should be fine, strategic partnerships are more suspect. We need to also play the long game and try to be friends with the people, even if have a fake grin when talking with the government.
We no longer deserve good will, not as a whole.
United we Stand, Divided We Fall.
We’re falling right now. We’re divided, and many of us can’t even speak to our own families any longer. The power of cruelty and stupidity in great numbers can cause untold chaos and destruction.
The United States has, at least for this moment, fallen. Nobody should rely on us as a whole. An internal conflict may be coming at this rate here, and it has the potential to tear us all apart. I hope it doesn’t come to this, but it is what I fear. Things are descending so quickly…
Goodwill? Yes.
But as long as the US political system is as it is and as long it will only flip-flop between democrats and Maga every few years, there can not be any trust anymore.
The US proved to be an unreliable partner.
How can any other country go into any. negotiations with the US without knowing the US can changed what they do at any time?
There is no basis for a deal, anymore.
At first, Zelensky rejected the proposal, but the two countries eventually reached an agreement on a revised version. Zelensky traveled to Washington to finalize and sign the deal.
However, tensions escalated when Zelensky tried to explain Russian President Vladimir Putin’s lack of diplomacy to Vice President Vance. Vance accused Zelensky of “litigating” in front of the media and criticized him for appearing in photos with Democrats during the 2024 campaign. He also said Zelensky’s comments were “disrespectful” to the Trump administration.
This sounds just like a setup to humiliate Zelensky and justify this shit to the MAGA brains. Trump and Vance weren’t planning on signing the deal. Pure and simple propaganda. But MAGAs don’t have enough neurons to see it.
Appearing in media with members of the current administration (just like now)? How dare he!
Also, a side thought I had recently: I wonder how these conservatives would feel if Mexico invaded and captured territory in Arizona? I mean, it wasn’t that long ago that it actually was a part of Mexico, and a lot of the population still identifies with that country. Just cede the land to avoid conflict, right?
Edit: Plus, everyone knows Arizona has a Nazi problem, so the invasion would be totally justified, right? Right? lol
I think a big part of this being cancelled at this late stage is Europe stepping up and offering peace keepers. I do not think Trump counted on that and wanted the deal with basically no peacekeepers. All along, he was was no to supplying security.
This would have given putin time to rebuild and carte blanche to renew the attack when he was able. Putin can’t do that if Europe is in Ukraine as that would be a massive escalation.
Yeah, I hate to see the US being such a fucking shit ally, but the one silver lining is that Europe does seem to be warming up to the idea of putting boots on the ground and beefing up support for Ukraine.
Russia isn’t going to stop trying to expand, especially after the tactical knowledge they’ve gained. All they want is a break to resupply and rebuild their army. Personally, I think we should have started sending in special covert ‘peacekeeping’ troops several years ago, and given Ukraine top tier kit when Wagner started marching to Moscow. We could have been in a position to devastate Russians military capability. Instead fucking Republican traitors held everything up. Screw the Arab spring, we need an American Spring. Get your scopes sighted in and your bugout bags ready
I wanted to point out something about what Trump said during that meeting…
“You’re in a bad position right now. You don’t have the cards.”
My understanding is that Ukraine did have the cards, they were called nukes, but they gave them up for peace and guarantees of protection from the United States, and others, against invasion.
And then, they got invaded.
Twice.
Edit: https://www.npr.org/2022/02/21/1082124528/ukraine-russia-putin-invasion
Edit2: Always pay attention to what the other hand is doing.
He also incorrectly tried to correct Zelensky on when his fucking country was invaded… Clown
Three times.
The Donetsk conflict was started by militias trained, supplied, and paid by Russia. With Russian troops entering Donestk for technical support, logistical support, and really just any help they needed including combat units to beat back the Ukrainian Army at several points.
Donetsk was the actual “Special Military Operation”.
The other hand just released that trumps name shows up 7 times in Eppstein’s flight logs.
No, not a joke, it was released today by trumps own minions.
This is where I saw it, top result for me of the last 24h:
Trump, like every arogant POS has overestimated his strength. Europe can and will enter the conflict as Russia has proven itself to be an existential threat. NATO is dead, but EU has been planning for this. I wouldn’t be surprised if UKR already has or will obtain a nuke and put on a show of force . Nuking Russian troops on its own territory would be fine- and provide ground denial to the Russians.
NATO is dead
Somebody better tell them. In the meanwhile, their twin sibling, OTAN, will take over.
I wouldn’t be surprised if UKR already has or will obtain a nuke
I’d think they would have stopped their war by now if so.
Nuking Russian troops on its own territory would be fine
I’m sure Mr. Radiation will cooperate and not float over any innocent cities, and will stay inside of the political borders where the bomb went off.
I’m also sure that nobody would consider retaliating over something like that, as it would be taken as just a minor misunderstanding.
And yes, /s .
Winds blow east in that part of the world.
They were counting on US support so they played nice. If Europe fails to do anything meaningful we might see UKR do something incalculable.
UKR knows that the only way to stop Putin is to match his posture. They have openly stated last year that they should get a nuke since US is unreliable.
Retaliate for nuking their own territory?
The scary thing is - ignoring these protection guarantees kills nuclear non proliferation.
Ignoring Ukraine for now, with a few French nukes we don’t have enough in Europe to do nuclear deterrence. The US not being a trustworthy partner anymore and with Russia on our doorstep that means long term we simply need more of our own. I hate the thought, but can’t find a way around it.
Because of Traitorapist Trump, every country in the world will rightly want to have their own nuclear weapons now. You just know that today is going to be mentioned in the history books as the beginning of widespread nuclear proliferation and the dire consequences that follow.
every country in the world will rightly want to have their own nuclear weapons now. You just know that today is going to be mentioned in the history books as the beginning of widespread nuclear proliferation
I’m honestly surprised other countries didn’t start proliferating after the first time Ukraine was invaded by Russia, years ago.
That’s one hell of an object lesson for any country to have learned, watching that happen.
For today, if nothing else, the lesson was learned, if you already have nukes, don’t give them up for promises of protection.
Wouldn’t have mattered even if true. Physical access trumps everything. Worst case scenario, if they really wanted to, they could reverse engineer the primer & guidance system, then replace the originals with their own.
Keep in mind that Ukraine was a massive hub for military industry in the USSR.
My understanding was that Ukraine did.
But also, since they were neighbors, you wouldn’t need to launch missiles, you could just take the payload out of a missile, stick it in a briefcase, and walk it over.
That was one of the most disgusting and rage-inducing videos I’ve ever seen. I would not have been able to restrain myself from punching Trump in the fucking nose if he had talked to me like that. I’m not a tough guy or violent in any way, and the Secret Service would have killed me, but the way he yells such insulting things at a world leader who is trying to save millions of lives… holy crap. And then Vance jumps in and claims he never said Thank You. I would’ve kicked him in the nuts and said, “thank you, now I feel better.”
This was a setup from the get go. They had no intention of signing any deal. This was all to get him in front of cameras with them so they could piss on his face and act like tough guys.
I particularly love the part where he says Obama sent them sheets and Trump sent them Javelins* then pauses to look at the camera and tell the media that that’s their headline. He may be losing his marbles, but that attention whore instinct goes straight to the core
* *Not sure if that’s the military aid he tried to block in order to coerce them into investigating the son of a political rival, or if he’s just taking credit for the aid sent under Biden that he actively opposed. Either way, it’s fucking rich for him to take credit for military aid when he is personally responsible for delaying and reducing the aid Ukraine got.
Trump had a reason for doing what he did. The former head of Kazakhstan’s intelligence service said 40-year-old Donald Trump was recruited by the KGB in 1987
Trump was so backed into a corner he reflexively rambled about Hunter Biden’s laptop and Hillary Clinton. What a joke. Then doubling down on Vance’s inane rambling about not showing gratitude, channelling peak abusive parent energy.
All because Zelensky made very reasonable points about requiring guarantees.
Absolute amateurs.
Yep. Trump is barely more intelligible than Alex Jones at this point. They’re both just as honest
Too bad there is no republican in congress sophisticated enough to realize they tied their cart to a psychotic, inane, horse that is going to drive them over a cliff.
