Philips screws are awful. They strip if you look at them wrong. Flatheads should only be used on thumbscrews just in case you need a little extra torque from a screwdriver.
Torx and Hex are excellent.
I work on electronics and woodworking and Phillips are the utter worst of both of them. The thread lock in computers makes them easy to strip when unscrewing. The resistance of driving them into wood makes them guaranteed to strip when screwing. Fuck them.
The big issue I see with people driving Phillips screws is that they don’t use a large enough driver size. Computer screws for example are Phillips #2 and I’ve never had an issue with them stripping.
I use the correct driver, I’ll go through my kit to find the best fitting bit. It simply comes down to the fact they are designed to strip to avoid “catastrophic failure”. Plus the fact that companies use intentionally cheap, soft screws, to make repair and service harder. Cough cough zinc screws on a $10,000 iMac (steel screws would have cost 25 cents for 10, zinc like 5 cents for 10, fucking ridiculous).
Maybe I’m just being lucky but I’ve never experienced screws stripping anymore since I’ve started getting better tools for myself.
And in woodworking it can also help to pre-drill a hole using your smallest drill, before screwing a screw in. This also prevents the wood from cracking. I’ve also seen wood screws that have some lubrication pre-applied.
The problem is, when working with electronics, you can have a great screwdriver but it won’t help if the screws in the device are very cheap (and probably partially stripped already from someone opening it previously).
Torx gang unite.
We had our 20 y/o deck repaired and stained last year. I was chatting with the overseer about what he was going to do and the topic of screws came up; he said he was going to use Torx, and only ever used Torx anymore - I just about cheered.
I’d been losing hope in humanity lately, but little signs of sanity like this, professionals finally getting rid of the hell-bits that are Phillips heads, lifts my heart and gives me hope.
I work at a big box hardware store, and I can confirm that almost all deck and structural screws are moving to torx. (much to the older generations dismay)
These days, all but the cheapest outdoor-grade screws in the US are torx, generally with a bit thrown into the box that, while cheap, should work fine for a few boxes’ worth.
I’ve heard that was more of a European thing, but the only two serious contenders are Pozidriv vs Torx for screws (and hex vs Allen for bolts).
I just checked my local hardware store’s website, and out of the 176 kinds of 4/4.5mm screw boxes in their inventory, 74 are Torx, 55 are Pozidriv, and 38 are Phillips (ew).
Either Torx or Pozidriv is fine when used properly, however most DIYers don’t understand the difference between PZ and PH and end up stripping their heads. Also it’s much harder to use the wrong-sized bit with Torx than PZ.
So yeah, Torx wins in just about every category and other heads only get manufactured to appease old people and penny-pinchers.
That’s one of my issues with Pozi - it can be hard to see the markings, and not everyone has great eyesight. I mostly object to Phillips-related screws because there are so many variations that mostly look the same and require a table to differentiate. And none have the torque-transfer performance of Torx. Plus, you can use a hex head in a Torx bit in an emergency and you don’t much care about either the bit or the head.
I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a philips or slotted deck screw. I have and have purchased many boxes of these things and they’ve always been nearly 100% Robertson. Is this a US thing?
Yes, and you’re Canadian. Robertson is the standard there, and while it’s used in other countries, not nearly as much.
In the beginning was slotted heads, mainly because mass machining and casting wasn’t good enough to have more precise forms. Then came the Great Connector Wars, and in the US the Phillips head won and was standardized; almost every house built in the US in the past 80 years will be built with these (and nails). Slotted heads are much less common, but you find them in various specific places, like where the heads are visible and you want to hide the screw as much as economically possible.
Canada, however, was smarter and standardized on the Robertson head; IIRC one reason for the divergence was the Phillips licensing cost. In any case, Robertson is superior to Phillips in most ways, except it’s even worse to dig out if it gets painted over.
As machining improved, many attempts were made to improve on Phillips, which mostly amounted to polishing a turd; Robertson remained unchanged as it was already pretty good.
Then came hex, which is great except it’s structurally pretty terrible for the head. Still, it can be seen as an improvement in Robertson, but not quite so good as to be worth all the retooling. Good enough that it’s probably the second, or at least third, most popular head in the US.
Finally, someone did some fucking math and came up with Torx, which is provably and demonstrably superior to all other screw heads. It maximizes force transfer, and leaves more material in the head; it’s harder to strip out, and can be applied effectively to very small screw heads. There’s a security version, which was mostly useless (for intended purpose) the day after it was released, but beyond that, there’s no real improvement that can be made.
The Phillips patents expired decades ago, so it’s holding on mainly from inertia. Commercial contractors don’t have much invested in it, because they have to literally buy boxes of replacement Phillips heads because of how shitty the design is and how often the heads break. While manufacturers have a steady stream of revenue from selling replacement Phillips tools that have broken, this is balanced by the mouth-watering prospect of every contractor in the US buying new Torx size-sets and high-end Torx tools. And the screw makers probably DGAF as they’ll sell screws either way; Torx screws might be a little more expensive - they used to be, but I haven’t compared lately.
Canada may just motor on using Robertson; there’s less incentive for them to retool since Robertson isn’t nearly as crappy as Phillips, so the cost/benefit to upgrade to Torx is less compelling. But who knows?
Flatheads should only be used on thumbscrews just in case you need a little extra torque from a screwdriver.
The only other legitimate use I’ve seen for flatheads is on wooden boats, where you’ll be gooping the head up with tar for waterproofing. Since you’ll eventually have to scrape it back off again to get to the fastener, you want a simple geometry that’s easy to clean.
Square (Robertson) drives are actually great too. Better than Hex/Allen, but Torx is the most reliable, and the most German. Phillips can take a long walk off a short pier.
I feel like spanner would be the best for not having shit getting stripped. But that’s just looking at this diagram; never seen them IRL.
Fuck this. Torx, Hex, square drive are all positive engagement. Phillips is literally designed to cam out. Slotted is just the first head type to have existed because of how easy it is to make, but is far inferior to every other type.
A good square bit for my impact is a lifesaver as an electrician. Pretty much every conduit fitting set screw can take flat, Philips, or square. When you’re reaching out one-handed from the top of a ladder, you really don’t want to cam out all the time.
Torx were basically invented because Henry Ford wanted to have exclusive use of the patent for robertsons and the Canadian didn’t want to do that.
Really not a fan of Hex (it just cams out way too easily) but Torx is like screwdriver orgasm. Philips just feels like intentionally bad design
Philips just feels like intentionally bad design
Philips are designed the way they are so that they “cam out”. Meaning if too much force is applied to the screw, the driver will intentionally pop out to avoid damaging the tool or the fastener. Its a feature, not a flaw. A Robertson (square), torx, or hex will let you apply enough force until the screw or the driver fail catastrophically.
If you’ve tried to do any large amount of work with slotted, you’ll know that it belongs in Mental Disorders. I’ll take Six-Lobe/Torx over phillips or slotted any day of the week.
Yea but fuck the security torx screws. Also hot take, but underrated screw goes to tri-wing/Y. They’d be great screws if they weren’t security screws as well.
Also hot take, but underrated screw goes to tri-wing
Is that a hot take? Everyone I’ve ever mentioned them to who knows what they are immediately starts shit talking both them and Nintendo for making us buy a screwdriver for one set of devices in our lives
Wow, person making this chart actually has no clue. First two are absolute worst nightmare. Torx, Pozidrive, JIS, Alan all great with minimum damage.
It’s the “grandpa has been using slotted all his life so it can’t be bad” reasoning. I can’t think of a single use case I’d want slotted or even philips, if I’ve got a choice. Torx or bust!
If you’re having trouble with Torx, buy better screws and bits. There are so many terrible screws around. The difference between a deep well fitting head and the cheap trash is massive.
If you’re having trouble with Torx, buy better screws and bits.
Last year I needed to do some hardwood construction outdoors. On the advise of a carpenter I ordered some high quality stainless steel Torx screws online. They don’t sell these in the consumer-oriented DIY store. They were awesome, much harder than the cheap screws, that would easily bend when driven into hardwood, much sharper as well and if you buy a box of 100 or more it comes with a bit which fits perfectly. So much easier to use than the overpriced crap from the DIY store.
Where are people buying shitty tor screws from? Walmart? Aldi?
I’ve only bought them from supply houses or home depot/lowes, and deckmates are a pretty damn good brand.
slotted screws are all fun and games, but if they’re ruined…you will never get them out. I coursed these screws. Eventually they got the dremel treatement.
