edit: thank you all for your replies! They are all very helpful. I am reading through them and will ask follow-up questions if needed.
I made a post some days ago asking about LineageOS, but my curiosity towards Google Pixels and GrapheneOS has been growing. As somebody who has always used regular Samsungs and iPhones, I hope somebody can clear up some questions I have regarding this OS.
I plan that my next phone is to be either a Motorola (LineageOS/SailfishOS?) or a Pixel (GrapheneOS). My first question about GrapheneOS, or really any non-standard OS, is this:
- how does having an account on the device work? For example, Samsungs require a Samsung account and iPhones require an iCloud account. How does it work on non-standard OSes?
My second question touches on built-in apps that you often get with every phone:
- does GrapheneOS have its own Notes/Drive/Photos/Messages app? If not, how does one go about obtaining these? Related question:
- how do I sync my notes/photos/files/etc to the “cloud” of GrapheneOS?
My third question regards the app store of GrapheneOS. I have heard that the sandboxed Play Store is better than FDroid, for instance; what are your thoughts? Do I go for Aurora Store instead? Is there any major difference at all? Is it possible to use multiple app stores?
- note that I likely won’t be solely relying on FDroid since I need some non-FOSS apps (FB Messenger for contacting family for example).
I know that in the privacy community, it’s very common to fix up a cloud of your own (i.e. NextCloud). I have no experience doing this, but is it something I must do when I install atypical OSes? Then comes the question about pricing, how private and secure it really is, which one to choose… and so on.
I understand many of these questions will sound stupid to those who are experienced, but I have not been part of this community very long. Feel free to link any educational videos or articles that answer my questions. I hope to learn more about this subject and one day installing a more secure system on my phone. Cheers!
- Your user account on GrapheneOS is just a local user account
- GrapheneOS comes with its own camera, gallery, contacts, sms, phone, and file manager apps, a hardened fork of Chromium called Vanadium, and an app that lets you install sandboxed versions of google play services and google play store, if you so wish. Nothing else. You can install other apps using F-Droid, or by installing the google play store app.
- GrapheneOS does not have a “cloud”, aside from the web services it uses to check for and pull new updates. If you want to sync files somewhere, you can install whatever you want (Nextcloud, Google Drive, etc)
- F-Droid is a fine choice, and the google play store is as well, all depending on what your priorities are for your phone. I only use F-Droid and have no non-foss apps on my phone for privacy reasons, for example.
- Running your own Nextcloud server is a great learning exercise, but it’s a big commitment of time if you’re not already familiar with linux administration, and if you want it to be secure and accessible remotely that’s even harder. Don’t let that be an impediment to getting a secure phone though - you can always keep using Google Drive for now, and then learn how to set up Nextcloud or some such as you go along.
Good luck!
Can we use Google maps and Google pay/wallet and Android auto? A previous look a while ago said no and I was bummed on that
Yes to google maps if you have the play services activated.
No to pay/wallet.
Yes to Android Auto as of recently. The grapheneos team just released a implementation of it.
Google maps does work if you give it the right permissions. Google Pay does not, as NFC doesn’t work under GrapheneOS.
- There’s no grapheneos account identifier.
- you can use any app you want.
- Usually nextcloud is the go to for cloud stuff.
- you can install play store or use aurora store.
Also, doesn’t Graphene sandbox the Play Store (and Google Services) if you install it?
Lineage (and DivestOS) enable you to install MicroG into a single user account on the phone (e.g. The work profile) and isolate it there.
The Graphene approach is even more restrictive, I just forget how they do it.
It’s just an app like any other. No special treatment
You can use a work profile but don’t have to. Grapheneos’ team don’t support fdroid or aurora store, hence they propose installing everything via play store.
Edit:
What do you mean it doesn’t support fdroid? I’m using fdroid on my GOS phone and GOS tablet.
- You don’t need an account, and there is no such thing as a GrapheneOS account. Most of your apps should be able to be installed through either F-Droid, Obtainium, or the sandboxed Play Store. Some apps require Google Play Services, however, but LineageOS has an alternative called microG which works most of the time, and GrapheneOS containerises apps.
- GrapheneOS, I believe, uses the default gallery and SMS apps from stock Android; and they also have their own camera, PDF viewer, and web browser (Vanadium), which are developed in-house. However, cloud syncing and note-taking apps are not included. I would suggest either having a look on F-Droid, asking on this sublemmy, or checking out Privacy Guides to find some apps you’ll like.
- GrapheneOS doesn’t have a “cloud”, as such. This is a good thing, and it lets you choose your own provider if you must. I would personally recommend Filen for files and photos, and Cryptee for notes.
- It is completely possible to use multiple app stores. If you use GrapheneOS, I would say use F-Droid or Obtainium when possible, and the Sandboxed Play Store for everything else.
- We like to use things like NextCloud because it gives us full control over our data, among other reasons. However, it is not essential. I, personally, use Filen for my cloud sync needs; but I also tend to use physical storage a lot because of my shitty internet and cheap hardware. You also don’t necessarily need to pay for these services, but it’s polite and it can improve your experience.
Good luck on your privacy journey, and don’t hesitate to ask more questions. In addition to Lemmy, here are a few good resources:
Hi! Thank you so much for the all the links, I really appreciate it. And thank you for introducing me to both Filen and Cryptee. Regarding Filen, I have a question. It says the price for lifetime starter is €30, but are there any other lifetime options (such as for the pro plans) that offer more storage?
I’m not entirely sure. I’m still using the free tier. A bit hypocritical for me to say that payment is polite, I know; but I do tend to use USB drives more than the cloud.
Do you know how Filen compares to Nextcloud or Syncthing? It’s definitely confusing to try to navigate in this huge technical world and know what service is the best haha
The past part sounds like a joke, love all the sources, but they all have a beef with GOS 😆
So bringing up GOS in those communities can spark some controversial discussions
In the meanwhile in GOS community it’s strictly prohibited to mention those projects, and every time any of the projects says “Graphene” GOS asks them to not to 😅
The past part sounds like a joke, love all the sources, but they all have a beef with GOS
It’s more the reverse. Some GrapheneOS users have had an extreme and obsessive hatred for anything associated with Techlore since the video revealing how insanely toxic the lead developer was. Because these people are borderline retarded, they associate criticism of a person’s behaviour as criticism of the project itself. As you say, Micay’s even gone so far as to outright censor discussion within that community. It’s all a bit sad and pathetic.
The Techlore community is pretty casual, they are nowhere near terminally online enough to “have beef” with another project. Discussion about GrapheneOS isn’t banned there, Techlore still has all his videos up recommending GrapheneOS, Privacy Guides still recommends GrapheneOS first in the Android section of their site, etc.
Mostly correct, but at the same time Techlore in their “Graphene toxic community” videos explicitly multiple times said that it’s better to avoid projects that have bad/toxic communities or devs
how does having an account on the device work? For example, Samsungs require a Samsung account and iPhones require an iCloud account. How does it work on non-standard OSes?
On GrapheneOS, you don’t log in to any online account. All your stuff is just locally stored on your device by default. You can install third-party apps to sync your data, but GrapheneOS has no online account/sync system built in.
does GrapheneOS have its own Notes/Drive/Photos/Messages app? If not, how does one go about obtaining these? Related question:
It has the standard Android (non Google) File manager, Gallery and SMS app. These aren’t particularly good though. I recommend Fossify apps, they are completely free and open source, respect your privacy and offer a pretty good user experience. Fossify has a notes app, gallery, file manager, SMS app, phone app (dialer), music player, clock, keyboard, launcher and some other stuff.
how do I sync my notes/photos/files/etc to the “cloud” of GrapheneOS?
GrapheneOS doesn’t have a cloud. You need to find a solution for syncing your data yourself. There’s DAVx5, which uses the WebDAV protocol, Nextcloud, EteSync, PhotoPrism, Immich and many more. They all serve different purposes. DAVx5 works with any WebDAV-compatible server, it lets you sync calendars, contacts and tasks. Nextcloud is a self-hosted replacement for things like Google Drive, it lets you sync files, calendars, contacts, notes, photos, bookmarks, recipies, basically everything you could imagine. Note that the official Nextcloud app only lets you sync files, but there are other Nextcloud-compatible apps on F-Droid that let you use more features of the Nextcloud server. Both PhotoPrism and Immich are self-hosted solutions for syncing your photos, Immich has an official Android app on F-Droid , PhotoPrism only has this unofficial one called Gallery for PhotoPrism. If you’re not into self-hosting, there are still good, private options out there. EteSync allows you to sync your contacts, calendars, tasks and notes, and it uses end-to-end encryption by default. You can self-host it, but you don’t have to. You can just pay them $2/month and they will handle it for you. Personally, I like to self-host my own instance of Etebase, the backend server for EteSync. Other private, cloud-hosted options are Proton for email, calendar and files or Ente for photos (their app is also on F-Droid).
My third question regards the app store of GrapheneOS. I have heard that the sandboxed Play Store is better than FDroid, for instance; what are your thoughts? Do I go for Aurora Store instead? Is there any major difference at all?
Personally, I use Aurora Store if I need to download something from Google Play.
Is it possible to use multiple app stores?
Yes, you’re not bound to one app store, you can use multiple ones.
You can DM me if you have more questions.
+1 for recommending Fossify over ‘SimpleApps’
Extending the reply for ‘Sandboxed Play Store … F-Droid … Aurora Store’ -
- In case of Sandboxed Play Store - we’d need to login via a Google account in order to be able to download apps. Also, when we allow network access to the Play Store, it may send device info, app downloaded, updated etc related telemetry to Google. Also expect the promoted apps/games ads in the Play Store home screen.
- In case of Aurora Store - we can use it via Anonymous User or we can supply our own Google Account. Aurora Store just uses the credentials to download apps from Google Play, but other telemetry is limited compared to Play Store.
- In case of F-Droid store - It mostly hosts open-source Apps. And has cautions whenever an app uses proprieray libraries, code or needs access to specific network(eg - Telegram FOSS needs Telegram Servers access to function) in order to work.
I’d recommend you have both - F-Droid and Aurora Store. If you need to access the Play Store subscriptions, then you’d need to install Play Store as well.
Grapheneos can be used almost identically to stock android. You can install google apps and use them or not. The biggest piece of it is the options.
There is no account associated to GOS. You can login to an existing google account etc, just like any android.
GOS has messages for SMS only. It had a Gallery app for photos and a files app for system files. There aren’t many apps it comes with, so getting alternative apps is easy. Mostly via Fdroid (or droidify for a more modern looking app). For a better photos app, I recommend “Aves” For a drive app, a private option would be proton drive. Notes app can be anything you want, but GOS doesn’t come with one. If you want to use google notes you can. I wouldn’t recommend it, but you can. There are lots on Fdroid to choose from.
As for cloud sync, GOS doesn’t do this, but again, you can use any other service you’d normally use to sync. I use Syncthing to sync a folder on my phone to a folder on my PC. That way I can have things like my photos easily on desktop and have backups.
As for app stores, GOS doesn’t recommend Aurora because they don’t sign the apps the provide, but I use it anyways, as it is the best way to get apps without a google account.
You definitely don’t need your own Nextcloud or Homelab. I prefer paying for hardware I own instead of cloud things, but both have good positives.
Also, your questions aren’t stupid their great! You’re just learning about this stuff that that’s amazing. Keep learning.
How’s adblocking? I need to use some apps from the Play Store and my blocker requires root to not be crappy. Is there something built in?
No adblocker built in, but Rethink DNS is a great app that will set up a local VPN and do firewall filtering and DNS filtering. There are other apps too and they should all work on any OS.
Personally I self host a VPN and pihole and stay connected to that
Checked it out, just realised how out of date my setup is now. I got some setting up to do.
No adblocker built in
They actually added a basic content blocker back in mid February, and plan on improving it over time:
Github source: https://github.com/GrapheneOS/Vanadium/releases/tag/122.0.6261.43.1
Discussion forum: https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/11000-vanadium-version-12206261431-released
